Emergency! I hear waswas

Uploaded by StopSpamming1 on 20.12.2011

Hi guys,
Skimming through some forum pages I found the posting of someone claiming to be an Arab
youth who started having doubts about his faith.
He says he did what I recommend to anyone wanting to find out why there are atheists:
read the book thoroughly. He says this intense reading is what is showing him the nonsensical
arguments and causing his doubts in the existence of a god. And now he is posting something
like: help! I started thinking.
Personally, I think this is a taunt, but that's irrelevant here. What happens now is that
the full force of Islamic warfare is brought out and aimed at this poster. You have superstition
and lies and pleading and threats - anything to keep this mind in the fold.
Where logics and reading of what he has written should tell them that he's already done some
research and is already telling them why there are reasons to call the Koran unscientific
and wrong. But nobody seems to notice.
They also ignore his most compelling evidence: the logics of having humans convey a message,
which sends another human into everlasting torture by an all-merciful god, if that human
should be wrong about something.
So this is the situation and now watch what happens when Muslims make suggestions they
believe will convince a human of the validity of a religion and the divine contents of a
First, we need to understand that in Islam you get something called waswas or wiswas
based on Koran 114:4-5. This represents what a child would do when whispering and is thus
allocated an important feature in Islam: the whispering of the devil. It is what the devil
would tell you to show you errors in the Koran and sow doubts about the existence of any
god. To lure you into the torture chamber: hell. Sure. Appealing.
And, this is what I do if I were the devil: positive marketing slogans about hell being
a poolside bar with interesting discussion partners. What devil would realistically admit
to torture to put people off rather than attract them? But the Koran paints the very graphic
picture of hell and has satan whispering in your ear.
Muslim clerics have thought about this and found some remedies to fix this problem, consisting
mainly of the incantation of superstitious magical words and rituals, such as spitting
three times to the left. But the most important thing is: STOP THINKING.
Why is it that some satan whispers into the ears of Muslims, who have a remedy? Why do
demons attack only Catholics who have a fearsome and skilled remedy: Catholic exorcists? How
come none of those ever talk to me? Anyway, just a by the by.
So let's get back to our case of the emergency situation which requires swift action before
this kid falls away and then manages to spread his de-conversion story amongst other Muslims.
Much like an anti-virus.
Once the situation is analysed, the first obvious question is: what translation are
you reading. Because it is totally inconceivable that a Muslim speaking Arabic can have second
thoughts about his book and religion. And telling someone about erroneous translations
and misunderstandings is so much easier.
But our young rebel quickly douses that hope by revealing that he is a native speaker.
Oh dear, now that makes it double hard for the apologetics.
The second line of defence is the same person that addressed my sinful questions regarding
the Koran: a person who says he's a female or a gay or maybe a real woman, although I
have my doubts. "She" addresses our rebel as "brother" seven times in as many paragraphs
and represents the appeal to emotion. She sends him off to the same 2 hour indoctrination
videos she sent me to watch. As if listening to Nouman Ali Khan holds any compelling reason
to believe anything in the Koran represents divine origins. Instead of addressing the
issue herself, she sends the guy to another station, a popular Muslim tactic. And khalifahklothing
who hosts the videos, is a deluded zealot who immediately censors any dissenting remarks.
This person who tries to plead with the rebel even goes so far as to claim "she" was an
atheist and now is "sure" that Islam is "the religion of truth". She is so deluded that
she does not realise this is exactly what the person with the doubts has challenged:
the personal attestation and the possibility of a human error putting him into eternal
punishment. And she does exactly this. How stupid, ignorant and callous do you need to
be to respond in this way?
The culmination of "her" pleading comes when she accuses the questioner of misunderstanding
of what he has learnt and heard all his life. And asking for patience - as if that will
help a person who has already made the first step away from religious indoctrination by
switching on his brain.
But this "sister" is not alone: a guy comes along and now - after the rebel has already
told them he rejects miracle claims on rational grounds - refers him to, of all people, Zakir
Naik. One of the most dishonest people in my opinion Islam has. Who claims mountains
are pegs, something the rebel has already dismissed as an incorrect representation in
the Koran.
Don't they listen?
Now another guy comes in who shows me how dishonest these guys are: when I proposed
videos on YouTube as an example of demonstrating a line of reasoning I was shunned because
YouTube is totally "unreliable and unscientific". But when it serves their purpose it is good
enough and accurate. We are being directed to a video by a Dr. Laurence Brown, who tells
us the usual crap about the Universe and abiogenesis not being possible without a god. He's a retired
Air Force doctor who was a Jew and a Christian and is now a Muslim living in Medina.
Next up is a guy who is the Muslim recipient of the Nobel Prize for geology. He claims
with absolute certainty that without mountains, "the surface would continue to slide". He
does not specify what surface and what would slide where and why continue to slide - which
is when we realise that since the inception of the Nobel Prize only 1 (in words: one)
scientific Nobel Prize has ever been awarded to a Muslim. And it's not to the person with
his geology nonsense. If anyone has managed to sit through the misleading and lying Nouman
Ali Khan has presented, well it continues right here with more of the same, the good
old "scientific miracle" claims which most rational Muslims have by now abandoned - even
Hamza Tzortzis.
After this we get a guy who is pushing the emotion envelope to its limits. "I have been
through" the same and many others have also and listen to your heart and soul and listen
to more indoctrination and propaganda and don't think or allow yourself to do the ultimate:
believe in evolution.
This seems to be the ultimate in challenging the Koran and Islam. I wonder whether he also
believes in gravity or atoms. What seems to be the most important thing for Muslims: listen
to people saying something positive about your belief. Whether it is true or not is
irrelevant - as long as it sounds nice. As long as it boosts your imaan, your spiritual
Next we get some drastic lies, pleading for the scientific accuracy of the Koran, which
any 14-year-old girl can ascertain is not true. But he does admit that scientists are
unable to detect angels. What all this has to do with a religious book, the Koran, and
the religion around it, remains unexplained, does not follow or make any sense.
Then we have this science professor telling us what geologists today don't know yet and
manages to make an even bigger mess by conflating different methods of how mountains are formed.
He then manages to bring forward the reason why non-Muslims are laughing about gullible
Muslims who don't understand or check anything. What can you do but ridicule someone saying
that without mountains we would have earthquakes and volcanic eruptions?
We also get a reference to a Muslim made video on how Muslims should interpret heavens and
the 823 possible layers of our atmosphere.
We then learn that one of these layers is where rain gets sent from - not from clouds.
Does the Koran contradict how the Universe and our sun was formed? Absolutely - but don't
tell that to a Muslim.
Lets go to the next level of emotional reasoning where we learn that stating there is proof
for the existence of a god and that doubting this is nonsense is a totally acceptable method
of conveying information, even if it is without any evidence, let alone proof. What is acceptable
is that you don't provide any kind of proof yourself, but send that person to do the work
themselves by reading propaganda and shutting off the rational and logical sections of your
The next layer to be applied is what I call selective truth. Tell a person to go and look
for evidence, but don't allow any objective criteria to slip in. Select a search engine
that blocks out all reality and only lets the dogma in that has been approved by Islamic
clerics. Anything else results in the censorship screen you get when attempting to access non-Islamic
I tried telling them that a specific site was harmless, but it never got fixed. Do they
care if someone can't access a webpage?
On the second part of this guy's "help" I noticed that our rebel mentions in sura 13
"Allah raised the sky without pillars" and the helper responds with a translation (God
who has raised the heavens without any supports that you could see) which differs and that
settles it. Erm what? How can a different translation change the fact? That there are
invisible pillars is an idea from the ancient past and should not be found in a scientifically
accurate text. His approach to not decide or prove anything himself and refer the asking
person to another institution or person is common practice with Muslims in general. But
consulting the Tafsir only confuses the issue as it says "meaning `there are pillars, but
you cannot see them'"
And then continues with "The heaven is like a dome over the earth, meaning, without pillars."
Go figure.
Next we have a guy repeating the old lie with the layers of the atmosphere, where he goes
a step further, claiming that we have several atmospheres, all protecting the planet from
harmful radiation. I seriously wonder what radiation he was exposed to at some stage.
This post takes the cake. #1 read the Koran and you understand it better
Man, the guy has just told you that reading the Koran more is the cause for his doubts.
Don't people think when they read? #2 don't waste time reading propaganda. Does
everybody know how to distinguish between propaganda and facts? Does he provide examples?
Does he show him how to do this? Does he just refer him elsewhere again, like any good Muslim?
#3 after telling him NOT to bother with propaganda he sends him to the #1 propaganda clown and
the fairy-tale factory of "scientific miracles" when the doubter has said this is exactly
what he doubts.
How should that HELP? If anything, it does the opposite! Don't they have any thinking
individuals there? So far there has not been a single piece of advice there that actually
addresses the situation or the problem.
Next up we have the most stupid and irrelevant miracle claim ever: drawing a line from Sanaa
to Mecca proves the divine origin of the Koran. Wow. I know there are a lot of double digit
IQ's out there, but this is single digit material. And Muslims wonder why 80% of the planet merely
If this is supposed to represent help I am sure anyone is better off without it: ignore
the world, just do your rituals and most of all: don't think! Oh I LOVE emotional ignorance.
Now the helpers start arguing with each other on what was said by whom and when. It's hilarious.
And the result of this squabble: "it's wrong to judge Quran by science. It should be the
other way around". Only science found in the Koran is correct science.
But one thing I am proud of: when discussing these miracles with me when I was still allowed
to post there, I told him that science is only a tool describing nature. It seems he
remembered this.
And finally we have someone who knows how to address a crisis such as this: establish
the basics and work from there. But with many people it would be too little and too late.
I hope you enjoyed this short excursion into the day-to-day life of a Muslim. It shows
how they manage to hold their little world together with misconceptions, lies and ignorance.
Just to protect what they think is the divine status of an old book.
Thanks for your time.