Regular 12/11/12 Session - Norfolk City Council

>>> SOME OF US HAVE HAD A LONG DAY.
I KNOT ENERGY WAS ON THE TRAIN -- I KNOW THE ENERGY WAS
ON THE TRAIN WITH US, WE LEFT TO GO UP THERE AT 10:30 THIS
MORNING. THOSE OF YOU WHO COULD MAKE IT,
I HOPE YOU ENJOYED YOURSELF. I APPRECIATE IT, WE HAD A GOOD
ATTENDANCE AT THE RECEPTION TONIGHT.
RICK MORMON IS ACTUALLY ENTERTAINING THE AMTRAK BOARD
TONIGHT, INCLUDING THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD AND THE EXECUTIVE
DIRECTOR OF THE BOARD, AND THEY'RE ON THE TRAIN AND VERY
EXCITED ABOUT THE NEW NORFOLK TRAIN, AS THEY CONTINUE TO CALL
IT. EVERYBODY CALLS IT THE NORFOLK
TRAIN. IT'S THE SOUTH HAMPTON ROADS
TRAIN, BUT WHO'S COMPLAINING, RIGHT?
SO IT'S THE NORFOLK TRAIN. I MEAN, EVEN AT AMTRAK IN
PETERSBURG WHEN THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT IT.
IS THAT WHERE YOU WENT TO SCHOOL?
>> YEAH. >> IT'S A BEAUTIFUL SCHOOL.
I MEAN, I WAS -- MR. VICE MAYOR, REALLY, IT WAS BEAUTIFUL RIDING
BY THERE. THEY HAVE A GREAT FACILITY.
THEY MUST HAVE IMPROVED IT. OBVIOUSLY SOME OF IT WAS NEW.
>> SOME OF IT, WE'VE EXPANDED OVER WHERE THE TRAIN STATION IS.
>> ANYWAY, THIS HAS BEEN A HISTORIC DAY FOR THE CITY.
TOMORROW MORNING IS GOING TO BE A CROWD TRYING TO -- EVERYBODY
TRYING TO GET ON THAT TRAIN. I'M TOLD SINCE -- YOU KNOW, WE
BULL LID THE MANAGER INTO TAKING -- BULLIED THE MANAGER
INTO TAKING OUT AN AD IN THE PAPER.
RIGHT AFTER THE AD CAME OUT, THEY SOLD 900 TICKETS WITHIN A
MATTER OF HOURS, SO ALL PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW IS A LITTLE BIT
ABOUT THE PRICES AND WHERE THEY'RE GOING.
THE AD REALLY SET IT OUT NICELY, AND SO THEY'RE SELLING MORE
TICKETS NOW SINCE THE WORD GETS OUT.
ANYWAY, WHY DON'T WE GET GOING HERE.
WE'VE ONLY GO ABOUT -- ONLY GOT ABOUT 40 MINUTES NOW.
>> MAYOR AND COUNCIL, THERE ARE TWO THINGS I'D LIKE TO BRING TO
YOUR ATTENTION BEFORE I TURN IT OVER QUICKLY TO RON WILLIAMS
ABOUT SOMETHING I THINK IS EXTREMELY EXCITING.
WE TALKED ABOUT RAPID IMPLEMENTATION AND HE'S GOING TO
TAKE ABOUT THREE MINUTES TO EXPLAIN TO YOU SOMETHING THAT
WILL BE OCCURRING IN JANUARY THAT WILL TAKE UP A BRIEF
COUNCIL MEETING. THERE ARE TWO ORDINANCES THAT
YOU WILL BE VOTING ON VOIN THAT, AGAIN -- ON TONIGHT THAT, AGAIN,
I WANT TO BRING TO YOUR ATTENTION.
ONE WAS THE APPROPRIATION FOR THE NORFOLK PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
THERE WAS A MEETING WITH THE COUNCIL AND SCHOOL BOARD, AND
THIS IS BASICALLY A SURPLUS FROM THE PREVIOUS FISCAL YEAR ENDING
JUNE 30, 2012, IN WHICH ABOUT $3.3 MILLION OF FUNDS ARE GOING
TO BE CARRIED OVER INTO THE FY '13 BUDGET.
SO THAT'S ONE OF THE ORDINANCES THAT YOU HAVE TONIGHT.
THE OTHER ONE IS THE CALENDAR, SOMETHING THAT YOU VOTE ON EACH
DECEMBER. IT WAS INTERESTING, DR. WHIBLEY
DID BRING UP A COUPLE OF POINTS. I BELIEVE WYNTER GAVE YOU A
COVER LETTER AND A MEMO ON FRIDAY WHICH BASICALLY SAYS THE
PROCESS OF HAVING A WORK SESSION ON THE FIRST TUESDAY OF THE
MONTH AND THEN AN INFORMAL MEETING AND A FORMAL MEETING ON
THE SECOND AND FOURTH. FOR THE MOST PART, THAT DOESN'T
PAN OUT EACH MONTH. SO WHAT WE'VE ATTEMPTED TO DO
IS, BASED ON A HOLIDAY AND BASED ON DIFFERENT EVENTS THAT COUNCIL
TYPICALLY ATTEND, LIKE, LET'S SAY THE NATIONAL LEAGUE OF
CITIES, WE MADE SURE THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE COUNCIL MEETINGS ON
THOSE PARTICULAR TUESDAYS. FOR THE MOST PART, YOU NEED TO
MAKE IT 36 A YEAR. 38 ARE BUILT INTO THIS.
WHEN I SAY 36, BASED ON THE ONES THAT YOU COUNT THE MEETING.
SO YOU HAVE A CALENDAR IN FRONT OF YOU TO VOTE ON TONIGHT BASED
ON INPUT FROM, FIRST OFF, WHICH YOU'VE TRADITIONALLY DONE WITH
MEETING CANCELLATION. I WANTED TO BRING THOSE TO YOUR
ATTENTION. VERY QUICKLY, THERE WERE A LOT
OF COMMENTS TODAY ABOUT AMTRAK. I APPRECIATE WHAT YOU SAID,
MR. MAYOR, ABOUT ME AND THE STAFF.
I WOULD LIKE TO SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE STAFF FOR 30 SECONDS,
RON WILLIAMS AND JOHN KEIFER IN TERMS OF THE PREPARATION, RON
PENNINGTON IN TERMS OF THE INTERGOVERNMENTAL CONNECTION,
SARAH PARKER WITH THE STRAENTS AFTER WE GOT HERE AND, OF
COURSE, THE POLICE IN PARKING, SO IT'S BEEN PRETTY MUCH A
SEAMLESS DAY SO I JUST WANTED TO TAKE A SECOND TO THANK THE STAFF
THAT MADE IT ALL POSSIBLE. >> YES, IT'S BEEN A SINGULAR
DAY. IT WORKED VERY EARLY IN THE
MORNING TO RIGHT NOW -- >> I WOULD SAY WE WERE IN
ASHLAND AND HENRICO COUNTIES AND THE WHOLE GIST OF IT WAS
NORFOLK, YOU KNOW. THEY CUT THE RIBBON AT EVERY
STATION, THEY TALKED ABOUT HOW EXCITED THEY WERE THAT THE TRAIN
WILL BE GOING TO NORFOLK AND THAT NORFOLK IS A PART OF THE
LINE NOW. SO THAT WAS -- IT WAS GREAT TO
SEE HOW OTHER CITIES EMBRACED US AS A MUNICIPALITY, SO I THOUGHT
THAT WAS GREAT. >> MARCUS, WITH THE $3.3 MILLION
CARRYOVER, JUST SO WE KNOW, HOW MUCH ADDITIONAL FUNDS, OR DO YOU
KNOW, THE SCHOOL SYSTEM HAD OVER AND ABOVE WHAT THEIR LAST YEAR'S
BUDGET WAS? THIS YEAR'S BUDGET, HOW MUCH HAS
IMPROVED? >> SURE.
IF YOU JUST GO BACK TO THE FY '12 APPROVED BUDGET AND YOU
COMPARE THAT TO THE FY '13 APPROVED BUDGET, USING THIS
CARRY-FORWARD ALSO, IT'S ALMOST 15 MILLION.
ABOUT $14.8 MILLION IN ADDITIONAL REVENUE FROM FY '12,
BUT THAT INCLUDES FEDERAL FUNDS, STATE FUNDS, LOCAL CONTRIBUTION,
SO ALL -- >> ADDITIONAL SALES TAX FROM THE
STATE, ALL THAT? >> YES, SIR.
>> YOU SAID 15 MILLION? >> ABOUT 14.8.
IT'S IN YOUR MEMO. >> RIGHT.
BUT WHEN I DISCUSS THIS WITH SOME SCHOOL BOARD MEMBERS AND A
FEW OTHERS, THEY DISPUTE THAT IT'S 15 MILLION.
AND I BELIEVE IN OUR JOINT MEETING WITH THEM, THAT THAT --
THEY EXPLAIN IT A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY THAN HOW YOUR BUDGET
OFFICE EXPLAINED IT AND I TALKED TO YOU ABOUT THIS AS WELL, AND
I'M WORRIED THAT THERE IS THIS MIS-KONG EXCEPTION THAT THEY'RE
GETTING -- THAT THEY HAVE ALL THIS EXTRA MONEY BEN SOME OF
THIS WAS -- WHEN SOME OF THIS WAS RESERVE MONEY THAT WAS
CARRIED OVER AND SO IT'S MONEY THAT WAS THERE AND I THINK THAT
THAT WAS SHARED WITH ME AS WELL, THAT THE BUDGET PRESENTATION
THAT I SAW, THAT WAS SENT TO ME, THAT THE SCHOOL BOARD MADE, IT
WAS ONLY SHOWING ABOUT 3.6 THAT YOU SEE IN THERE.
SO ARE YOU INCLUDING THE ADDITIONAL FUNDS FROM WE ADDED
IN -- >> SURE.
>> -- WITH EVERYTHING AS WELL? >> SURE, IT'S PRETTY EASY.
YOU START WITH THE APPROVED BUDGET FOR '12 AND THE APPROVED
BUDGET FOR '13 AND IT'S ABOUT 12 MILLION MORE.
>> BUT IT'S NOT 12 MILLION MORE IN TAX REVENUE THAT HAS COME
INTO OUR DISTRICT AND ADDITIONAL MONEY THAT THEY CAN SPEND ON
OTHER PROJECTS OR THINGS THAT WERE CUT.
BECAUSE SOME OF THAT MONEY WAS ALREADY BUDGETED IN LAST YEAR'S
BUDGET, SO IT'S BEING LUMPED IN WITH THAT.
IT REALLY IS THE 3.6 MILLION THAT'S EXTRA IN TAXES?
>> NO. THERE IS A -- THEY GET
ADDITIONAL MONEY FROM THE STATE. THEY GOT ADDITIONAL MONEY FROM
THE STATE. THEY RECEIVED ADDITIONAL MONEY
FROM THE CITY. THAT ADDITIONAL MONEY DOESN'T
MEAN THAT THERE WAS ENOUGH TO TAKE CARE OF ALL THE COST
INCREASES, WHETHER IT WAS HEALTHCARE OR SALARIES.
SO FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, CLEARLY IT'S NOT THIS BIG CASH
INFUSION. SOMETIMES ADDITIONAL MONEY FROM
THE STATE WASN'T ENOUGH TO COVER THE COST -- THE ONGOING COSTS,
BUT JUST IN A SHEER DOLLAR VOLUME, YOU TAKE THE FY '12
BUDGET VERSUS THE FY '13 BUDGET, SOME OF IT IS CARRY-FORWARDS,
SOME OF IT IS NOT SPENDING MONEY, BUT JUST FROM THE CITY
PICKING THINGS UP, AND FROM A COMPARISON OF ONE FISCAL YEAR TO
THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR, YOU ADD THE ADDITIONAL 3.3, IT'S WELL
OVER $14 MILLION ADDITIONAL FUNDS.
THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S MONEY WITH NO STRINGS ATTACHED TO IT.
>> RIGHT. I JUST HAVE A CONCERN THAT IT
GIVES THE APPEARANCE THAT THEY HAVE EXTRA MONEY, THAT MUCH
EXTRA MONEY BECAUSE 15 -- WHEN YOU SAY 15 MILLION, IT MAKES IT
SOUND LIKE THERE'S ALL THIS MONEY LYING AROUND NOW THAT THEY
CAN USE ON THINGS AND THAT IS NOT WHAT I'M HEARING FROM THE
SCHOOL BOARD. >> SURE.
>> AND IF THIS GOES BACK TO THE CONSTANT COMMUNICATION THAT WE
NEED TO HAVE WITH THE SCHOOL BOARD AND DR. WHIBLEY AND I WILL
BRING UP A PROPOSAL LATER, YOU KNOW, WITH -- WORKING WITH THE
SCHOOL BOARD, BUT I THINK INSTEAD OF HAVING THAT ONE HOUR
TYPE MEETING WITH THEM WHERE WE GET A PRESENTATION, THAT WE NEED
TO HAVE A DEEPER DISCUSSION WITH THEM AND I THINK THAT'S PART OF
THE -- SOME OF THIS MISCOMMUNICATION OR WHAT'S
HAPPENING WITH THIS. AND I DID HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT
THE CALENDAR AND IT'S JUST A SMALL ONE.
I KNOW WE DON'T HAVE TIMES ON HERE, BUT ANY TIME WE MISS A
SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH, A TUESDAY, AND THEN WE HAVE A
THIRD MEETING, WE TEND TO SCHEDULE THAT AS A WORK SESSION
AND WE DO A 2:00 MEETING, BUT THE MEETING WOULD HAVE BEEN A
5:00 MEETING AND THEN 7:00. SO I'M JUST ASKING, BECAUSE WE
HAD DISCUSSED, YOU KNOW, OVER A YEAR AGO ABOUT MOVING MORE OF
OUR MEETINGS TO THE EVENING, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE LATELY WHEN WE
RESCHEDULE THESE, THAT THEY ARE BECOMING 2:00 MEETINGS AND
THEY'RE NOT -- THEY'RE MORE JUST JOINT MEETINGS WITH COMMITTEES
AND THINGS. YOU KNOW, IF WE'RE GOING TO BE
DOWN HERE, LET'S MAKE IT A PRODUCTIVE MEETING AND MAKE IT
LONGER. WE HAVE ITEMS ON THE AGENDA,
LIKE TONIGHT WE HAVE A PRETTY PACKED AGENDA, BUT WE'VE BEEN
HAVING A LOT OF 2:00 MEETINGS LATELY AND I THINK OUT OF
COURTESY TO THE CITIZENS, IT WOULD BE NICE TO HAVE SOME MORE
EVENING MEETINGS ON THERE. SO WE DO HAVE TO DO THAT, THOSE
MEETINGS SHOULD BE MORE IN THE EVENING.
I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY ELSE AGREES WITH ME BUT --
>> I LIKE THE CONCEPT OF HAVING WORK SESSIONS AND NOT -- AND I
THINK THAT'S WHAT WE INITIALLY WERE ATTEMPTING TO DO, CUTTING
DOWN ON THE FORMAL ONES. >> RIGHT.
>> AND I PERSONALLY WOULD RATHER, IF WE'RE HERE, I'D
RATHER HAVE A VIGOROUS AGENDA, YOU KNOW, FOR THE FORMAL
MEETINGS AS OPPOSED TO -- BECAUSE IN THE PAST, WE'VE HAD
SOME PRETTY SHORT FORMAL MEETINGS AND IT SEEMS KIND OF
SILLY TO GET EVERYBODY HERE. I LIKE HAVING THE WORK SESSION.
>> IF THEY'RE PRODUCTIVE. >> BUT I DON'T MIND IF YOU WANT
TO DO A WORK SESSION AT 5:00 IF THAT WORKS BETTER FOR YOUR
SCHEDULE. >> IT'S NOT JUST MY SCHEDULE.
I JUST THOUGHT WE HAD DECIDED THAT WE WOULD HOLD MORE EVENING
MEETINGS AND WHEN WE'VE HAD A SERIES OF WORK SESSION IS AT
2:00, BUT NOT MEETINGS WITH AGENDA ON THEM, THEN WE'RE NOT
GETTING THE CITIZENS AS INVOLVED WHEN WE GO BACK TO THE 2:00
MEETINGS. >> I THINK THE CITIZENS ARE
INVOLVED WHEN WE HAVE 2:00 MEETINGS, AND RATHER WHEN WE
HAVE 7:00 MEETINGS, WE DON'T GET A WHOLE LOT OF EXTRA CITIZENS IN
THE GALLEY ANYWAY. I MEAN, A LOT OF PEOPLE STREAM
ONLINE, THEY WATCH ON TELEVISION.
I THINK THAT GOES A GREAT DEAL TOWARD GETTING PEOPLE INVOLVED
SINCE THEY KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON AND IF THEY HAVE AN ISSUE WITH
SOMETHING, THEY CAN E-MAIL US OR TEXT US OR WHATEVER THE CASE MAY
BE, BUT I DON'T THINK THAT WE GET A WHOLE LOT OF EXTRA PEOPLE
AT NIGHT. I MEAN, WE GET PEOPLE, BUT I
DON'T THINK WE GET A WHOLE LOT OF EXTRA.
>> IS YOUR POINT THAT WE SHOULD HAVE AT LEAST TWO NIGHT
MEETINGS? >> RIGHT.
THERE'S BEEN -- RECENTLY, WE'VE BEEN HAVING JUST WORK SESSION
MEETINGS AND NOT -- WE'VE BEEN KIND OF, LIKE TONIGHT'S AGENDA,
WE'RE KIND OF CRAMMED IN AND IF WE DO HAVE TO DO THAT WHERE WE
HAVE TO TAKE OUT A SECOND OR FOURTH MEETING, THEN IF WE MAKE
UP THAT MEETING, IT SHOULD BE MADE UP AS A FORMAL AGENDA TO
CUT BACK ON THE AMOUNT OF ITEMS THAT ARE ON THERE.
I WASN'T SAYING, YOU KNOW, WE -- THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS ON THE
AGENDA TONIGHT. >> WELL, LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE
ON THIS AND THEN IF WE HAVE TO --
>> YOU'RE RIGHT. >> SO THEN YOU OUT, RON'S
PRESENTATION IS ABOUT FOUR MINUTES AND FRANK'S IS ABOUT
THREE, SO IT'S A VERY FAST SESSION TONIGHT.
IF YOU WOULD LIKE US TO JUST GET STARTED.
>> ARE WE OKAY TO AT LEAST VOTE ON IT TONIGHT?
WE CAN MODIFY IT AT ANY TIME. >> THE CALENDAR?
>> YEAH. >> JUST UPDATE THE TIMES.
>> DIDN'T THEY HAND IT US OUT A WRITTEN FORMAL AND CHANGED THIS.
>> NO, I THINK YOU RECEIVED THIS IN OCTOBER, SO WE GAVE YOU THE
12-MONTH ACTUALLY CALENDAR WITH THE DATES AND TIMES.
WE GAVE IT TO YOU OCTOBER, WE GAVE IT TO YOU NOVEMBER, SO WE
JUST GAVE YOU THE SHORT SHORT VERSION TODAY.
>> RIGHT. IT'S HANDED OUT IN A HARD COPY
THERE. >> I DON'T HAVE PROBLEMS WITH
THE DATES. I WAS JUST ASKING ABOUT FORMAL
MEETINGS AND SPREADING THE AGENDA OUT INSTEAD OF CRAMMING
IT ALL IN. WE COULD HAVE DONE SOME OF THIS
LAST WEEK IF WE HAD AN EVENING MEETING.
>> US OLD GUYS OVER HERE ARE -- >> MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL, AS
CITY MANAGER SAID, A FOLLOW-UP TO WHAT WE DID ABOUT A MONTH
AGO, TALKING ABOUT IMPLEMENTATION AND WHAT WE WANT
TO DO IS JUST INTRODUCE THIS EVENING A GROUP THAT WE'RE GOING
TO ENGAGE WITH THAT WORKS WITH CITIES, DEVELOPERS AND
STAKEHOLDERS TO CREATE QUICK IN THE SENSE OF HIGH IMPACT CHANGES
THAT CAN IMPROVE AND REVITALIZE UNDERUSED PROPERTIES AND
HIGHLIGHT POTENTIAL FOR COMPLAETING GREAT STREETS.
THIS TEAM OF JASON ROBERTS, ANDREW HOWARD, A CERTIFIED
PLANNER, THEY HAVE BEEN HIGHLIGHTED IN MANY PUBLICATIONS
AND ON NPR. THEY HAVE RECEIVED AN AWARD FROM
THE AMERICAN SOCIETY OF LANDSCAPE ARCHITECTS AND THE
WHITE HOUSE'S CHAMPION OF CHANGE.
THEY'RE COMING AND I'D LIKE TO SHOW A QUICK HIGHLIGHT OF VIDEO
TO GIVE YOU SOME FLAVOR FOR WHAT TYPE OF WORK THEY DO.
>> WHAT WE DID WITH THE BETTER BLOCK IS WE TAKE A BLOCK LIKE
THIS AND OVER A DAY OR -- >> IT WAS WORKING EARLIER, I SAW
IT. THEY TRIED IT OUT EARLIER.
>> WE'LL COME IN AND WE'LL RETROFIT THE SPACE.
WE'RE GOING TO BRING OUT TREES, LANDSCAPE, DEVELOP BUSINESSES IN
THESE -- >> REWIND IT.
>> MAKING SPACES, WE'RE -- IN A DAY OR TWO, WE'LL COME IN --
WHAT WE DID WITH THE BETTER BLOCK IS WE TAKE A BLOCK LIKE
THIS AND OVER A DAY OR TWO, WE'LL COME IN AND WE'LL RETROFIT
THE SPACE. WE'RE GOING TO BRING OUT TREES,
WE'RE GOING TO BRING OUT LANDSCAPING, DEVELOP POP-UP
BUSINESSES IN THESE SPACES, GOING TO HAVE COFFEE SHOPS,
FLOWER SHOPS, OUTDOORS SEATING, BUILDING A RAIN GARDEN THAT'S
GOING TO HELP FILTER THE WATER THAT COMES INTO THE AREA AND IT
MAKES IT CLEANER WHEN IT GETS INTO THE ACTUAL -- THE RIVER.
FOR SAN ANTONIO, IT'S GREAT BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE AN AMAZING
DOWNTOWN AND THIS IS A CHANCE TO SHOW HOW ON SOME OF THE EDGES OF
DOWNTOWN WHERE THERE'S NOT AS MUCH ACTIVITY AS YOU HAVE IN THE
CENTER, WHERE YOU CAN PUSH OUT AND REACTIVATE THIS AREA.
BETTER BLOCKS ARE IMPORTANT FOR A COMMUNITY, IT'S A DIFFERENT
WAY TO ENGAGE A COMMUNITY IN REFARING A NEIGHBORHOOD.
BEFORE THIS, THIS WOULD BE A SERIES OF TOWN HALLS THAT WOULD
TAKE PLACE AND YOU MEET WITH THE COMMUNITY AND TALK ABOUT IDEAS
AND THESE IDEAS GO BACK TO A DRAWING BOARD, AND BY THE TIME
THEY GOT FILTERED THROUGH A LOT OF DIFFERENT LAYERS, IT TOOK
YEARS FOR SOMETHING TO ACTUALLY HIT THE GROUND, SO THIS IS A WAY
THAT COMMUNITY CAN WITHIN DAYS MAKE A CHANGE AND SHOW HOW THEY
CAN HELP TAKE OWNERSHIP OF THE ESTATE, SO REALLY WHAT WE FOUND
IS THE BENEFIT, EVEN THOUGH IT'S A DEMONSTRATION PROCESS, THE
BENEFITS LAND FOR MONTHS OR YEARS AFTER THIS AND MANY OF OUR
BETTER BLOCK PROJECTS, THE BUILDINGS START GETTING LEASED
WITHIN MONTHS. YOU START SEEING MORE BUSINESSES
COME BACK TO THE AREA, AND IT HELPS THE CITY DEMONSTRATE HOW
THEY CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE QUICKLY BECAUSE SOMETIMES SOME
OF THESE IDEAS AND CONCEPTS THAT WE PUT OUT HERE ARE AN ABSTRACT
FOR FOLKS UNTIL THEM TOUCH IT AND SEE IT.
>> BETTER BLOCKS WAS GROWN OUT OF THE IDEA OF COMMUNITY
REVITALIZATION, REHABBING OLD BUILDINGS AND SHOWING HOW
MULTIMODAL TRANSPORTATION CAN MAKE CITIES WHOLE.
>> THIS IS PART OF THE CITY OF SAN ANTONIO COMPLETE STREETS
INITIATIVE. CITY COUNCIL RECENTLY PASSED AN
ORDINANCE THAT SAYS THAT ALL STREETS ARE GOING TO BE LOOKED
AT FOR MULTIMODAL TRANSPORTATION, LIKE BIKE LANES,
STREET STARS, BETTER PEDESTRIAN AS A ACCESS.
WE'RE GOING TO BUILD THE PICTURE AND BUILD IT IN A DAY.
THE RESPONSE HAS BEEN IN OTHER CITIES THAT WE SEE IT RAPIDLY
GOING TO MAKE IT PERMANENT. WE'D LOVE TO SEE IT HERE AS WELL
THAT WE GET BIKE LANES ON JONES, NEW WAYS OF PUTTING IN PARKING
TO MAKE IT SAFER, TRANSIT STOPS THAT ARE MORE FRIENDLY.
WE ALSO WANT TO SEE A DIFFERENT APPROACH TO SOME OF THE
REVITALIZATION OF OLDER BUILDINGS, THAT THOSE CAN BECOME
ADAPTIVE AND RESPOND TO WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS.
>> THAT'S THE HIGHLIGHT OF THE SAN ANTONIO PROJECT.
WHAT THEY'RE COMING TO DO IN JANUARY IS ACTUALLY CONDUCT THE
SURVEY AND SEE IF A BETTER BLOCK DEMONSTRATION PROJECT COULD BE
CONDUCTED. THEY WILL LOOK AT PUBLIC AND
PRIVATE SPACES, THE QUALITY OF THOSE SPACES, THE POTENTIAL FOR
RAPID REDEVELOPMENT. THEY'RE GOING TO GIVE US A
DETAILED ANALYSIS OF COMMUNITY ASSETS, POTENTIAL STAKEHOLDERS
AND QUICK WIN OPPORTUNITIES THAT ALLOW FOR A LAUNCH PAD FOR
POTENTIAL DEMONSTRATION, AND THEN THEY WILL IDENTIFY ANY
MATERIALS OR RESOURCES THAT BEST BE UTILIZED IN THAT COMMUNITY.
WE'RE RECOMMENDING THAT THEY SURVEY AS PART OF THE AGREEMENT
TO DO THE SURVEY, WE'RE RECOMMENDING FOUR AREAS THAT
THEY LOOK AT, THREE OF WHICH ARE STRATEGIC ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT
AREAS IN OUR DRAFT PLAN 2030, 35th STREET COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR,
THE NORVIEW, FIVE POINTS AND DOWNTOWN OCEAN VIEW DISTRICT UP
HERE AT THE END OF GRANBY STREET, AND THEN ALSO OUR
PROPOSED ARTS REVITALIZATION. >> SO HOPEFULLY THE CONCEPT LAST
TIME WITH RAPID IMPLEMENTATION AND THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT
WILL BE LONGER TO ANALYZE AND REVIEW, BUT WE BELIEVE JUST
BASED ON THE COUNCIL'S DIRECTION, THIS IS THE RIGHT WAY
TO GO. >> GOOD.
OKAY. .
[ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> I'M GOING TO TRY AND DO THIS
VERY QUICKLY. >> THEY LAUGH, TERRI, BUT THEY
WILL UNLEASH. >> THIS IS AN ITEM THAT THE
PLANNING COMMISSION HEARD IN NOVEMBER FOR WHICH WE HAD A
NEGATIVE VOTE, TO BASICALLY UNDER YOUR DIRECTION, WE NEED TO
BRIEF YOU ON THIS SO WE CAN GET --
>> IT GOT HOW MANY NEGATIVE VOTES?
>> ONE. >> DID WE REALLY SAY WE WANTED
EVERY -- >> YOU SAY ANYTHING WHERE STAFF
IS RECOMMENDING DENIAL OR YOU HAD ANY NEGATIVE VOTE, YOU
WANTED A PRESENTATION BEFORE YOU --
>> ONE NEGATIVE VOTE OUT OF SEVEN?
>> DR. NEWMAN WAS THE NEGATIVE VOTE.
>> WOW, ONE OF THE NEWBIES. >> YES.
>> YOU PROBABLY REMEMBER THIS BECAUSE WE DID THE REZONING FOR
THE ONE AND A HALF ACRE LOCATION ON MONTICELLO, BETWEEN 17th AND
18th ABOUT A YEAR AGO AND BEFORE THAT IT WAS A SERIES OF
COMMERCIAL USES THAT ARE ALL IN THE PROCESS OF GOING AWAY.
IT IS DESIGNATED FOR MULTIFAMILY USES BOTH IN THE CURRENT GENERAL
PLAN AND THE PROPOSED GENERAL PLAN.
CURRENTLY, IT IS APPROVED FOR 130 DWELLING UNITS WITH 1.6
PARKING SPACES PER UNIT, WHICH IS CONSISTENT WITH ITE STANDARDS
AT THE TIME THIS WAS APPROVED. WHAT THEY'RE NOW PROPOSING AS
BRAND-NEW DESIGN AND THIS IS BECAUSE THE COST OF THE ORIGINAL
DESIGN DIDN'T WORK. THEY'RE LOOKING TO INCREASE THE
NUMBER OF UNITS TO 164 UNITS, BUT ALSO GOING TO INCREASE THEIR
PARKING RATIO FROM 1.6 PARKING SPACES PER UNIT TO 1.63, WHICH
IS STILL CONSISTENT WITH ITE STANDARDS AND THEY HAVE AGREED
TO A SERIES OF AMENITIES NOT INCLUDED IN THE ORIGINAL
PROPOSAL. THIS IS THE DESIGN THAT IS
CURRENTLY APPROVED, SO THAT AT THE STREET LEVEL, WHAT YOU ARE
SEEING IS PARKING. THIS IS WITH A PLAZA INSIDE.
THIS IS ALSO PART OF WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED AND ONE OF
THE CHALLENGES YOU'VE GOT IS WITH THIS CONFIGURATION, THE
COURTYARD AREA IS CONSTANT SHADE, WHICH BECOMES AN ISSUE.
WHAT THEY PROPOSED AS NEW DEVELOPMENT THEME THAT WILL BE
PART OF THE DOWNTOWN DEVELOPMENT CERTIFICATE THAT WILL BE COMING
BACK TO YOU. THIS HAS BEEN REVIEWED AND
RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL BY BOTH THE DESIGN REVIEW COMMITTEE AND
THE PLANNING COMMISSION. THIS IS THE FLOOR PLANS, SO WHAT
YOU'RE GETTING IS A LESS NARROW OPEN SPACE, IT WILL NOT BE IN
CONSTANT SHADOW. THEY ARE STILL GOING TO BE
PROVIDING A SWIMMING POOL AND UNDERGROUND PARKING WHICH HAS
BEEN REVIEWED BY FEMA AND IT DOES MEET THE FLOOD STANDARDS SO
WE DON'T HAVE THAT ISSUE. THAT'S HOW THEY'RE ACTUALLY
ADDING THE ADDITIONAL PARKING. AT PUBLIC HEARING, THE APPLICANT
APPEARED IN SUPPORT AND WE HAVE A LETTER OF SUPPORT FROM THE
GHENT BUSINESS ASSOCIATION. THERE WAS NO OPPOSITION.
STAFF RECOMMENDED APPROVAL BASED ON CONSISTENCY WITH THE GENERAL
PLAN, COMPLIANCE WITH ALL ORDINANCE REQUIREMENTS, AND IT'S
DESIGN AS A VERY URBAN BUILDING. PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDED
APPROVAL ON A 6-1 VOTE. THE MAJORITY SUPPORTED THE STAFF
RECOMMENDATION AND THE MINORITY VOTE, DR. NEWMAN WAS TOLD BEFORE
THE MEETING BY A REPRESENT OF THE GHENT NEIGHBORHOOD LEAGUE
THAT THE ITE PARKING STANDARDS HAD CHANGED AND THAT THE 1.63
PARKING SPACES PER UNIT WAS INCONSISTENT WITH THE EDITION OF
THE ITE PARKING STANDARD. IT IS COMPLETELY CONSISTENT WITH
THE ITE PARKING STANDARD -- >> IS THAT THE --
>> SERIOUSLY, IS THAT THE MOST RECENT?
>> 2010. >> THAT'S THE MOST RECENT.
>> THIS IS THE MOST RECENT. IT IS STILL CONSISTENT.
YES? >> I'VE BEEN CONTACTED BY ONE OF
THE DEVELOPERS AND THEY'RE READY TO GO AND HOLDING THEM UP COSTS
THEM MONEY AND IS THERE A WAY WE CAN MOVE THIS TO HEAR IT AT THE
NEXT MEETING, LIKE IN JANUARY, WHICH IS A MONTH FROM NOW,
RATHER THAN HAVING A CONSENT AGENDA AND MOVING IT AHEAD.
>> THAT WOULD BE AT THE DIRECTION OF COUNCIL.
IF WE INITIATE THE ADVERTISING, WE COULD MOVE --
>> DOES ANYBODY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT?
YOU CAN VOTE IT UP OR DOWN, BUT I WOULD TRY TO ACCOMMODATE
SOMEBODY MAKING AN INVESTMENT IN THIS DISTRICT.
CAN WE SCHEDULE IT FOR THE NEXT --
>> TELL ME AGAIN, HOW MANY UNITS ARE THERE NOW?
>> 130 TO DATE AND THEY ARE ASKING TO GO TO 164.
>> 164? >> YES.
>> HOW MANY PARKING SPACES ALTOGETHER IN 164 --
>> I'D HAVE TO DO THE MULTIPLICATION.
>> MULTIPLY IT TIMES 1.6. >> HOW MANY STORIES IS THAT?
>> WE'VE GOT FIVE STORIES. >> ARE THEY GOING TO DO
(INAUDIBLE). >> YEAH, THEY'RE DOING THEM --
THEY CAN STILL DO THE STICK OVER STEEL BECAUSE OF THE -- THEY'RE
DOING IT ABOVE THE PARKING PORTION.
>> AND EVERYBODY THINKS FIVE STORIES IS OKAY?
>> IT'S EITHER FOUR OR FIVE STORIES.
THE HEIGHT IS FINE. THE HEIGHT WILL BE COMPATIBLE
WITH WHAT'S AT THE ALEXANDRIA AT GHENT.
IT'S GOING TO LOOK REALLY SQUARE INSTEAD OF REALLY LONG AND
CLOSING THAT STREET. >> GOOD EVENING, EVERYBODY.
I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU A QUICK UPDATE ON THE GHENT STATION 21st
STREET DEVELOPMENT PROJECT. I'LL ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT
YOU MIGHT HAVE. JUST AS A REFRESHER, WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT A 3.57 ACRE SITE THERE ON 21st STREET BETWEEN
HOLLY AVENUE AND HAMPTON BOULEVARD LOCATED ACROSS FROM
HAP HOUSE AND THE ANIMAL CLINIC. THIS IS THE CURRENT CONDITION OF
THE PROPERTY AS OF OCTOBER. WE BEGAN WITH AN RFP ON THE SITE
AND WE NOT FOUR RESPONDENTS, AND THE SELECTION WAS A MIXED USE
COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT. THEY WERE UNABLE TO GET THE
CHANGES LINED UP FOR THE PROJECT AND FOLLOWING THAT, ONE OF THEIR
PARTNERS, EMPIRE DEVELOPMENT, SUBMITTED A LETTER OF INTENT IN
2010 FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE SITE FOR MEDICAL OFFICE USE.
AGAIN, THEY WERE UNABLE TO SECURE THE TENANT NOR THE
FINANCING, AND IN THE SPRING OF 2011, THAT EXPIRED.
>> CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT THE PRICE WAS BACK IN 2008?
WHAT WAS THE OFFER AT THAT POINT?
>> I'M NOT POSITIVE OF WHAT THE STAUNTON PARTNERSHIP OFFERED.
>> I'D LIKE TO KNOW THAT. I MEAN, DON'T WE THINK THAT'S
PERTINENT? >> IN TERMS OF LOOKING AT IT FOR
WHAT -- IT WAS CLEARLY NOT WHAT WE WERE LOOKING TO DO THERE,
WHICH WAS ALL RETAIL. >> I THOUGHT IT WAS FIRST
(INAUDIBLE). WAS IT FRESH MARKET?
>> I AM NOT CERTAIN WHO THEY HAD.
THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT TRADER JOES AND WHOLE FOODS AND WITH
FRESH MARKET. >> IT WAS FRESH MARKET.
>> WE DID DO A 2009 STUDY SPECIFIC TO FRESH MARKET TO TRY
TO PURSUE THAT, BUT WE FELT LIKE THE MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT AT
THAT TIME WAS THE WAY THAT WE COULD GET -- WE'LL FIND OUT AT
OFFER NUMBER FOUR. THAT'S THE HISTORY OF THE ROCK
2000 STANDARD PARTNERSHIP AND HERE IN NORFOLK, HARBOR HEIGHTS,
TOWN POINT CENTER, RIVERSIDE CORPORATE THE DOMINION
ENTERPRISES, THE FBI BUILDING AND PORTFOLIO RECOVERY HERE IN
NORFOLK. THE GHENT STATION OVERVIEW AS
$17.5 MILLION TOTAL PRIVATE INVESTMENT OF WHICH 10 PI
5 MILLION WILL BE COMING FROM US AND THE PARTNERSHIP FORMING
GHENT STATION. $7 MILLION IN ADDITIONAL FF&E
BETWEEN THE GOURMET GROCERY STORE AND THE MEDICAL OFFICE
BUILDING. SPLIT EVENLY BETWEEN THOSE TWO.
WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS A 26,560-SQUARE-FOOT MEDICAL
OFFICE BUILDING, 100% OCCUPIED BY BON SECOURS, SPECULATIVE
GROCERY RETAIL SPACE ADJACENT TO THE SUPERMARKET, THREE BAYS,
4200 SQUARE FEET FOR A TOTAL OF 50,260 SQUARE FEET.
USES FOR THE BON SECOURS FACILITY WILL BE PHYSICAL
THERAPY, OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH. YOU CAN READ THOSE.
BASICALLY ESTIMATING JOBS OF 39 JOBS FROM THIS PARTICULAR SIZE
PROJECT AND THOSE AVERAGE SALARIES ARE ALL ABOUT $68,000 A
YEAR. >> WHO'S GOING TO BE TAKING
THOSE, THEY'RE SHIFTING PEOPLE --
>> THERE IS SOME CONSOLIDATION. >> NOT AGAINST THE JOBS.
I'M JUST SAYING FOR TRUTH IN ADVERTISING, WE NEED TO --
>> YES, MA'AM, AND I THINK THE REPRESENTATIVES FROM BON SECOURS
ARE GOING TO SPEAK TO YOU AND GIVE YOU THAT PARTICULAR
BREAKDOWN AND LET YOU KNOW HOW THEY'RE -- WHAT IT IS FF&E THEY
ARE ADDING ALONG WITH THE NEW INTRODUCTION OF PHYSICAL
THERAPY. GOURMET GROCERY IS ESTIMATED TO
BE GENERATING 80 TO 90 NEW JOBS AND THEY ANTICIPATE SPENDING
ABOUT $3.5 MILLION IN THEIR FIXTURES AND FURNISHINGS.
WE'RE RECOMMENDING A SALE PRICE OF $500,000 AND CREDITING --
>> CAN YOU BACK UP FOR A SECOND? YOU SAID THE 3.5 MILLION, IS
THAT ON TOP OF THE 17.5 MILLION? >> NO, THAT $17.5 MILLION IS THE
TOTAL INVESTMENT -- >> TOTAL INVESTMENT BY
EVERYBODY? >> YES, SIR.
>> OKAY. >> AGAIN, IF WE WERE TO CREDIT
$250,000 TOWARD THAT DEMOLITION EXPENSE, OUR INTERNAL ESTIMATES
ON THAT WERE $450,000, WE WOULD PROPOSE THAT IN THE LDDC, THERE
WOULD BE LANGUAGE PROHIBITING THE ASSIGNMENT OR RESALE OF THE
PROPERTY FOR A PROFIT WITHIN TWO YEARS AND TRIGGERING AN
ADDITIONAL $350,000 PAYMENT IF THE FIRST TWO YEARS, THIRD YEAR
275, FOURTH 200, FIFTH 125,000, KEEPING IN MIND THAT AS LONG AS
THEY SUSTAIN A BON SECOURS MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING AND A
GOURMET GROCERY STORE, WE WILL CONTINUE TO RECEIVE THE BENEFIT
OF THE ESTIMATED $185,000 A YEAR IN DIRECT TAX REVENUES OUT OF
THIS PROJECT. >> SO WE'RE GOING TO SELL IT TO
THEM FOR 500,000 AND THEN CREDIT THEM 250,000 FOR THE DEMOLITION.
>> THAT'S RIGHT. >> SO BASICALLY WE'RE SELLING IT
TO THEM FOR 250,000. >> AND THREE YEARS AGO IT WAS
$3 MILLION. IN YOUR TIMELINE, OR IN YOUR
HISTORY, WHERE DID JOE MARCELL COME IN.
>> HE CAME TO US THIS YEAR. >> NO, HE CAME IN BEFORE BECAUSE
DR. WHIBLEY WAS TALKING WITH HIM.
HE CAME IN BEFORE THIS PROJECT WAS ON THE TABLE AND WANTED TO
DO RETAIL -- COMMERCIAL ON THAT PARTICULAR SITE.
>> THE FRESH MARKET. >> YEAH, FRESH MARKET OR TRADER
JOE'S, AND SO THAT WAS -- YOU DIDN'T HAVE THAT IN THE
TIMELINE. >> I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE WAS
EVER ANY OFFER MADE BY JOE MARCELL FOR STRAIGHT RETAIL,
SINGLE LINE ALONG THE RAIL TRACK.
>> HE HAD A STRIP CENTER RIGHT ALONG THE TRACK.
>> BUT ON THAT SITE. >> I DON'T THINK HE HAD A FRESH
MARKET. >> NO, HE DID HAVE THE FRESH
MARKET. HE'S THE ONE WHO BROUGHT FRESH
MARKET TO VIRGINIA BEACH. >> HE SAID HE COULD ATTRACT A
GORE RAY GROCERY STORE TO -- GOURMET STORE ON THAT LOCATION
AND HE PLANNED DO A STRAIGHT LINE RETAIL ALONG THE TRACK.
>> I UNDERSTAND, BUT HE'S THE ONE WHO BROUGHT FRESH MARKET TO
VIRGINIA BEACH, SO THERE WAS NO REASON TO BELIEVE THAT HE
COULDN'T DELIVER A FRESH MARKET IN GHENT.
>> I WOULD SAY, MR. VICE MAYOR, THAT WHAT HE MAY HAVE BEEN ABLE
TO DO AND WHAT STAUNTON AND CHRIS SANDERS WERE DEFINITELY
ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH WAS A STRING OF COMMITMENTS AND PROMISES.
>> THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN DO THAT IS HAVE SITE CONTROL.
>> THAT'S CORRECT. >> SO THEY HAD SITE CONTROL.
>> THEY HAVE SUBMITTED UNDER THAT LETTER OF INTENT THAT WE
PRESENTING HERE THIS EVENING TO TURN INTO A CONTRACT, YES, SIR.
>> AND THAT'S THE ONLY WAY THAT YOU -- THEY WON'T EVEN TALK TO
YOU UNLESS YOU HAVE SITE CONTROL.
>> JOE MARCELL CONTINUES TO INSIST THAT HE SAW THIS AS A
RETAIL ONLY SITE AND THAT WOULD BE A STRIP CENTER ALONG THE RAIL
LINE, WHICH WOULD NOT BE CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE WERE
LOOKING FOR ACCOMPLISH ON THIS PARTICULAR SITE IN GHENT.
>> BUT THAT SHOULD BE A PART OF THE EVOLUTION OF IT IN TERMS OF
OFFERING 3 MILLION, A MILLION, AND THEN GETTING TO THIS.
>> WELL, IN THE INTERESTS OF THIS, WE ALSO HAVE RECEIVED A
LETTER FROM MR. LEVINE FOR $2 MILLION WITH A TOWN CENTER
TYPE CONCEPT THAT HE WAS TALKING ABOUT WANTING TO PRESENT AS A
POSSIBILITY FOR THE SITE. >> YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT AFTER
THE FACT. I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT TIMELINES
BEFORE WE GOT TO THIS POINT, AND THAT WAS IN 2007 WHEN HE OFFERED
US A MILLION DOLLARS FOR THE SITE.
>> I'D HAVE TO GO BACK AND SEE WHETHER OR NOT -- WE DON'T HAVE
ANY WRITTEN EVIDENCE THAT JOE HAD SUBMITTED THAT IN 2007.
>> WELL, WE WERE TALKING WITH JOE BECAUSE I WAS A PART OF THE
CONVERSATION. DR. WHIBLEY HAD PERMISSION AS TO
RELATES TO WHETHER THE PROPERTY ABUTS THE PROPERTY OR WHETHER IT
SITS UP OR SITS BACK, SO THERE WAS NEVER ANY QUESTION AS
RELATES TO WHETHER OR NOT HE WAS EVER INTERESTED IN THIS SITE.
THE MERE FACT THAT HE OFFERED US A MILLION DOLLARS FOR THE SITE,
BUT IF WE'RE GOING TO BE GIVING PRESENTATIONS, AT LEAST BE
ACCURATE WITH THE INFORMATION, HOW WE GOT FROM 3 MILLION TO
ONE MILLION TO WHERE WE ARE NOW. >> I WILL GO BACK AND RE- --
>> WE AREN'T VOTING TONIGHT, RIGHT?
>> YEAH, BUT I JUST WANT THE INFORMATION TO BE -- WE HAD
ANOTHER PERSON WHO WANTED IT, THAT JUST WASN'T WHAT WE WERE
LOOKING FOR. >> WE DIDN'T RECEIVE ANY WRITTEN
OFFERS FROM MARCELL OR ANYBODY ELSE.
>> GO BACK TO THE DEMOLITION. >> YES, SIR.
>> THE SALE PRICE IS 500,000. >> YES, SIR.
>> AND WE'RE GOING TO GIVE THEM 250 TOWARDS THE DEMOLITION.
>> CORRECT. >> SO IN ESSENCE, THEY'RE PAYING
$250,000 FOR THE PROPERTY. >> YES, SIR.
>> OKAY. NOW -- AND THEN '09, THE COOPERS
WERE GOING TO PAY 3 MILLION FOR IT.
>> RIGHT. >> WHY WOULD WE PAY FOR THE
DEMOLITION? I MEAN, WHO STRUCK THAT DEAL?
WHY ARE WE PAYING FOR THE DEMOLITION?
I LIKE THE PROJECT, BUT WHEN I SAW THIS PART OF IT, YOU KNOW,
IT KIND OF GIVES ME A LITTLE HEARTBURN AND IN MY MIND THE 250
IS A DEAL BREAKER BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THEY SHOULD BE ABLE
TO WALK AWAY WITH THAT SITE FOR $250,000.
>> WELL, WE HAD DONE INTERNAL ESTIMATES THAT SAID IF WE WERE
TO TAKE DOWN THE BUILDING OURSELVES, THAT NUMBER WOULD BE
$460,000. >> BUT AGAIN, $2.5 MILLION LESS
THAN SOMEBODY OFFERED IT IN '09, SO THAT SHOULD --
>> YES, SIR, AND AGAIN WHAT I WOULD SAY, IS THEY WERE UNABLE
TO SECURE THE AMENITIES OR THE FINANCING.
>> I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT THE VALUE IN PROPERTY, NOT THE
COMPLETION OF THE DEAL. A LOT OF PROPOSALS, I GUESS WE
GOT AT LEAST TEN THAT WENT SOUTH, YOU KNOW, BACK DURING THE
TIME WHEN WE HAD THE -- WHEN THE BANKS WEREN'T LENDING MONEY AND
I'M JUST LOOKING AT THE 250 AND THAT JUST CAUSES ME A LITTLE
HEARTBURN AND I'M JUST WONDERING IF IT'S DEAL BREAKER.
SEEMS TO ME LIKE THEY SHOULD PAY 500 FOR IT AND DEMOLISH IT
THEMSELVES. >> WELL, THAT IS NOT --
>> WE HAVEN'T SIGNED ANYTHING WITH THEM YET, HAVE WE?
>> NO, SIR. WE MIGHT HAVE AN LDDC.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE PRESENTING THIS EVENING.
>> LDDC? >> LAND DISPOSITION DEVELOPMENT
CONTRACT. >> ARE WE VOTING TONIGHT ON THE
PRICE OR TO AUTHORIZE THE CITY MANAGER TO NEGOTIATE TO FINALIZE
THE DEAL? >> IT'S ON THE -- THE CONCEPT,
ALL OF THIS IS BEING SHOWN TO YOU TODAY IS WITHIN THE
AGREEMENT, BUT WE HAVEN'T SIGNED IT, SO IF THERE WAS SOME SMALL
CHANGES, THE MANAGER IS AUTHORIZED TO DO ANYTHING
CONSISTENT WITH WHAT YOU'RE APPROVING TONIGHT.
>> ALL RIGHT. ARE YOU FINISHED?
MAYBE WE CAN TALK AFTER THAT. >> SURE.
BASICALLY, AGAIN, THE $185,000 IN DIRECT CITY REVENUE IS BASED
UPON WHAT WE BELIEVE TO BE A 30% INCREMENTAL INFLUENCE ON THE
SITE AND $13,000 IN ESTIMATED INDIRECT TAX REVENUES.
WE BELIEVE IT DOES REMOVE THE BLIGHTING INFLUENCE AND DRAG ON
REAL ESTATE VALUES IN THE AREA, THAT THERE ARE ROUGHLY 130 NEW
JOBS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS PARTICULAR DEVELOPMENT.
IS THERE AN IMPACT ON REAL ESTATE VALUES?
WE WENT BACK AND LOOKED AT THAT, WE DO BELIEVE THIS WILL INCREASE
AND ENHANCE PROPERTY VALUES IN THE AREA.
WE SOUGHT THE OPINIONS OF A COUPLE OF WELL-RESPECTED
APPRAISERS IN THE COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE INDUSTRY.
WE DO HAVE LETTERS FROM THEM TO THE EFFECT THAT THE KINDS OF
DEALS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE UNDERSTOOD AND NOT USED AS
BENCHMARKS TO VALUE OTHER PROPERTIES.
THE ADDITIONAL FACTORS INCLUDE THE ECONOMIC BENEFIT TO THE
CITY, THAT THERE WOULD BE NO NEGATIVE IMPACT ON THE VALUES IN
THE AREA, AND, IN FACT, WHEN THE PUBLIC ENTITY SELLS A PARCEL AND
IF THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE SITE IS OF A CHARACTER AND CALIBER
THAT ENHANCES THE PROPERTY, THEN PROPERTIES IN THE SURROUNDING
AREA ARE POSITIVELY INFLUENCED. >> THE LANCE IS APPRAISE -- LAND
IS APPRAISED AT $5 MILLION. >> THE LAND IS --
>> WE GOT AN INDEPENDENT APPRAISAL.
THAT LAND IS -- YOU TELLING ME IT'S NOT APPRAISED AT 5 MILLION?
>> NO, SIR, I'M NOT. I'M TELLING YOU THE OFFSET VALUE
YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS (INAUDIBLE).
>> SO I'M SAYING -- YOU'RE SAYING THE SETBACK, BUT IT WAS
APPRAISED AT 5 MILLION. >> WELL, INCLUDING THE
STRUCTURE. THE STRUCTURE THAT'S ON IT IS
CERTAINLY INFLUENCING THE APPRAISED VALUE.
CURRENTLY, THAT BLIGHTING -- >> THIS IS AN INDEPENDENT -- I
LIKE THE PROJECT, BUT I'M -- WE GOT TO STOP DERIVING TO THIS
POINT THE WAY THAT WE DERIVE AT IT.
THIS IS RIDICULOUS. ALL I'M SAYING IS THAT I'M A
TAXPAYER BEFORE I'M A COUNCIL PERSON ON THIS COUNCIL AND WE
ALWAYS SIT AROUND THIS TABLE AND TALK ABOUT WE DON'T HAVE MONEY
TO DO, WE NEED MONEY TO PUT OVER HERE, SO WHEN WE DEVELOP AREAS
LIKE THIS, WE DEVELOP THEM FOR A REASON.
SO WHEN WE BEGIN TO DISBURSE PROPERTIES LIKE THIS, THAT WE
CAN GET A PREMIUM FOR, BUT WE CAN USE THAT MONEY TO DO OTHER
THINGS WITHIN THE CITY AND STOP TALKING ABOUT WHAT WE DO ON THE
BACK END FOR AN AREA THAT IS DEVELOPED AS THAT PARTICULAR
AREA, I BELIEVE WE -- WE DO DEALS ALL THE TIME.
YOU KNOW, WE MAKE A DEAL HAPPEN. I BELIEVE AT THE END OF THE DAY,
THIS THIS IS GREAT PROJECT, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT?
I THINK IF WE HAD HELD THE LINE GOING IN TO THE NEGOTIATIONS
HERE, THEY WOULD HAVE STILL DID THE PROJECT AND WE WOULD HAVE
GOT A LITTLE UP FRONT AND WE'D HAVE STILL GOT ON THE BACK END
IN THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT. THAT'S ALL I'M SAYING.
>> LET ME -- I MEAN, EVERYBODY CAN HAVE THOSE -- LET ME GO WITH
MY THING. SOMETIMES WE SELL PROPERTY FOR
LESS ISN'T THAT'S WORTH IN ORDER TO ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT.
>> I UNDERSTAND THAT. >> SOMETIMES WHEN WE'RE BUYING
PROPERTY, WE PAY TOO MUCH FOR IT IN ORDER TO ASSEMBLE PROPERTY TO
MAKE THINGS HAPPEN. WE MAY BE DOING THAT TONIGHT.
>> NO, WE'RE NOT. >> WELL, WE -- WELL, THAT
MIGHT -- BUT I THINK THERE'S VALUE IN WHAT WE'RE DOING
TONIGHT, OKAY? >> BUT YOU WANT TO VOTE --
SERIOUSLY, YOU WANT TO GO THERE --
>> NO, BUT YOU WANT TO GO HERE, ANTHONY, AFTER -- YOU KNOW, I'M
GOING TO BE -- I'M BEING HONEST, I'M A TAXPAYER TOO.
>> I LIKE THE PROJECT, BUT I'M JUST SAYING --
>> I'M A TAXPAYER TOO, OKAY? LET ME PUT IT THIS WAY.
WE HAVE FROM TIME TO TIME -- SOMETIMES WE ACTUALLY MAKE THE
PROPERTY PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT, DIDN'T CHARGE ANYBODY
ANYTHING ON THE WELLS FARGO BUILDING, FOR INSTANCE, EVEN ON
THE MacARTHUR CENTER, I GO BACK -- YOU CAN GO, NAME ANY
NUMBER OF TIMES WHERE WE HAVE TRIED TO INSPIRE DEVELOPMENT,
GOOD DEVELOPMENT, THIS IS $17.5 MILLION.
THERE'S 120 JOBS. THIS IS A PIECE OF PROPERTY, I
DON'T KNOW HOW THE APPRAISALS WENT BEFORE, BUT, ANTHONY, THAT
BUILDING IS SITTING ON THERE RIGHT NOW, AND PAUL, THEY ARE
BLIGHTING INFLUENCES ON THAT PROPERTY, ON THAT ENTIRE
CORRIDOR. >> I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THAT.
>> THOSE THINGS HAVE GOT TO COME DOWN.
AND IN ORDER TO MAKE THE PROPERTY WORTH ANYTHING TO
ANYBODY. RIGHT NOW THE SENIOR CENTER SITS
THERE, I MEAN, THERE'S -- IT'S BROKEN INTO, STRIPPED OF ALL OF
ITS COPPER. I MEAN, IT'S STRIPPED -- THERE'S
ANTISOCIAL BEHAVIOR THAT GOES ON BEHIND THE BUILDING ALL THE
TIME. WE'RE ALWAYS ROUSTING PEOPLE OUT
OF THERE. THIS IS A PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT
SITS UP AGAINST THE MOST HEAVILY TRAVELED COAL LINE IN THE
COMMONWEALTH, MAYBE THE COUNTRY LEADING UP TO THE, UP TO THE
LAMBERT'S POINT PIER, SO IN ORDER TO GET -- THIS IS NOT
2007. THINGS HAVE CHANGED, SOME OF THE
RULES. CITIES ARE DOING THINGS, YOU
KNOW, MORE AGGRESSIVELY IN ORDER TO SPUR DEVELOPMENT.
THIS IS NOT A MILLION -- I'D MUCH RATHER HAVE A MILLION, BUT
I'M PREPARED TO TAKE THIS IN ORDER TO MAKE THOSE JOBS HAPPEN,
TO MAKE THIS A PIECE OF PRODUCTIVE REAL ESTATE
DEVELOPMENT AGAIN FOR THE CITY, NEARLY A COUPLE HUNDRED THOUSAND
DOLLARS A YEAR IN ADDITIONAL REVENUE.
WE'VE BEEN TRYING TO MAKE SOMETHING HAPPEN HERE FOR, WHAT,
FIVE, SIX YEARS NOW. WE'VE HAD AT LEAST TWO RFPs AND
A COUPLE OF INDEPENDENT -- MR. MARCELL, I THINK, I HEARD
ABOUT THAT, HIS OFFER AS WELL, BUT THIS IS THE ONLY CONCRETE --
I MEAN, AT THIS POINT IN TIME, CONCRETE PROPOSAL WE'VE GOT THAT
I ACTUALLY WENT TO BEN SECOND CURES AFTER THIS -- BON SECOND
CURES AFTER THE PROPOSAL QUAME IN AND TALKED TO HIM AND SAID
ARE YOU SERIOUS ABOUT COMING HERE?
BECAUSE I WOULDN'T WANT TO GO DOWN THIS ROAD AND MAYBE WRITE
DOWN THE PRICE OF THIS PROPERTY, I DIDN'T WANT TO GO THERE UNLESS
WE WERE VERY CONCERN THAT THIS WAS GOING TO HAPPEN.
HE WAS VERY CONCERN AND, IN FACT, ANTHONY YOU WERE WITH ME
THE OTHER DAY WHEN THE HEAD OF BON SECOURS SAID THEY WOULD
MAYBE LIKE TO DOUBLE THE SIZE. THERE'S A LOT OF GOOD THINGS
THAT HAPPEN UP AND DOWN THE CORRIDOR IF THIS GOES FORWARD.
I'D LIKE TO HAVE MORE MONEY, BUT AT THE END OF 2012, THE
ADMINISTRATION HAS REVIEWED IT AND THEY'RE PREPARED TO
RECOMMEND IT AND I THINK WE OUGHT TO GO FORWARD WITH IT.
I WISH THE DESIGN WAS SUCH THAT THE SUPERMARKET COULD SIT UP
CLOSER TO THE STREET, BUT I UNDERSTAND WHY THEY DON'T THINK
THEY CAN DO THAT TOO BECAUSE OF THIS RAILROAD.
>> ALL RIGHT. SO I'M JUST -- I GUESS -- HAVE
YOU TALKED TO THE DEVELOPER ABOUT THIS?
HAS HE PRESENTED TO YOU? THE DEVELOPER?
>> I MEAN, I'VE TALKED WITH HIM ABOUT IT.
I HAVEN'T TALKED WITH HIM ABOUT -- YEAH, I HAVEN'T GOT A
PRESENTATION FROM HIM. >> A COUPLE OF THINGS.
I'M JUST GOING TO GO THROUGH THIS VERY QUICKLY.
I THINK IT'S PRUDENT TO KNOW WHAT THE SAME DEVELOPER OFFERED
PREVIOUSLY BECAUSE HE OBVIOUSLY HAD THE NUMBERS WERE GOING TO
WORK THEN AND IF HE OFFERED MORE THEN, WHY ARE THE NUMBERS NOT
WORKING THIS TIME? I DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT.
AND I THINK IT'S -- I'M DISAPPOINTED THAT WASN'T
AVAILABLE TO US. SECONDLY, TELL ME WHAT THE
AVERAGE RENTS ARE IN GHENT? >> $17.56.
>> AND WHAT ARE THESE RENTS? WHAT ARE THESE RENTS GOING TO
BE? >> THEY ARE STILL IN
NEGOTIATIONS WITH THE TENANTS, BUT I WOULD TELL YOU THAT THEY
ARE BELOW THAT FOR THE SUPERMARKET AND THEY ARE BELOW
THAT FOR THE OFFICE SPACE. THERE IS A FULL SERVICE LEASE
THAT'S BEING -- >> HOW FAR BELOW ARE YOU
ANTICIPATING? >> I WOULD SAY ON THE OFFICE, A
COUPLE OF DOLLARS A FOOT, AND ON THE GOURMET GROCERY STORE, AT
LEAST TWO DOLLARS A SQUARE FOOT. >> SO DOES THAT NOT MAKE AN
IMPACT ON OUR AREA? I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE TELLING ME
THE APPRAISALS DON'T, BUT IF YOU ARE RENTING BUSINESSES ON THE
CORRIDOR AND THIS IS BEING UNDERCUT, IS THAT NOT
SIGNIFICANT? >> NO, I -- NO, MA'AM.
LET ME JUST SAY THAT ON THE ANCHOR GROCERY BUSINESS, THEY
WILL ALWAYS COME IN AT THE NUMBER THAT'S GENERALLY LOWER
THAN WHAT ANY OTHER SMALL TENANT RETAIL MIGHT BE WILLING TO PAY.
THERE IS 4200-SQUARE-FOOT OF THREE BAYS OF SPACE THAT WOULD
BE LIKELY MARKETED AT $17.56, OR WHATEVER --
>> BUT THE OFFICE BUILDING WILL ALSO BE BELOW THE NORM?
>> IT IS JUST BELOW THE NORM BECAUSE, AGAIN, BOTH OF THESE
USERS ARE UNABLE OR IN THIS DEAL, IN TERMS OF THE RETURN ON
THE INVESTMENT THAT THE DEVELOPER WAS LOOKING TO MAKE
VERSUS WHAT THEY COULD PAY, THAT'S HOW WE BACKED INTO THE
DEAL THAT WE'RE PRESENTING HERE THIS EVENING.
THE RETURN ON THE INCOME FOR THE DEVELOPER IS NOT THAT HIGH.
FOR US, IN TERMS OF THE RETURN THAT WE'RE GETTING ON THIS
$2 MILLION VALUE OF THE PROPERTY, ABOUT 9.21% OVER TEN
YEARS, WE'LL BE REPAID IN ABOUT 8 1/2 YEARS ON THIS PROJECT.
EVERYTHING AFTER THAT WILL ACCRUE TO OUR BENEFIT.
>> I'M JUST GOING TO SAY, I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY THE SITE
CANNOT BE CHANGED. AND EXPLAIN TO ME WHY WE HAVE TO
PUT UP WITH A SUBURBAN NON-PEDESTRIAN CORRIDOR APPROACH
AS THEY ARE SHOWING US IN THIS GROCERY STORE.
TELL ME WHY THAT -- AND IF IN FACT WE VOTE THIS TODAY, I'M
ALSO CONFUSED WHY WE'RE VOTING TODAY IF IT'S BEING PRESENTED
TODAY. I THOUGHT THAT WAS THE DEAL,
THAT IT WAS PRESENTED AND THEN THE NEXT MEETING, WE VOTE.
SO I'M NOT SURE ON THAT ONE EITHER.
BUT -- OKAY. SO AM I VOTING TODAY FOR THAT
SITE PLAN? >> NO, MA'AM.
IT STILL HAS TO GO THROUGH SITE PLAN REVIEW.
>> AND SO WILL I BE VOTING ON IT LATER?
THE SITE PLAN? >> THEY WILLS WORKING WITH --
WILL BE WORKING INTERNALLY WITH US IN TERMS OF --
>> I'M ASKING IF I'M GOING TO BE VOTING AGAIN.
>> NO. NO, MA'AM.
>> I THINK THIS IS IT. YOU CAN --
>> SO EXPLAIN TO ME, PAUL, WHY THIS CAN'T BE CHANGED.
>> WELL -- >> EXPLAIN TO ME.
I'M WILLING TO GIVE THIS GUY A DEAL, BUT LET'S ASK FOR A LITTLE
SOMETHING BACK. LET'S MAKE THINGS GOOD.
>> I AGREE. >> EVEN WITH THE NORFOLK
SOUTHERN RAILROAD BACK THERE. >> YES.
>> IF HE BROUGHT THE THING UP TO THE STREET -- WELL, FIRST OF
ALL, THE TENANT, FRESH VALUE, WON'T COME IF IT SITS ON THE
STREET CORNER BECAUSE THEY WANT THE PARKING IN FRONT OF THEM SO
PEOPLE CAN GET OUT OF THEIR CARS AND THEY CAN BE SEEN FROM THE
STREET. AS A PRACTICAL MATTER, IF YOU
BROUGHT THE BUILDING UP TO THE STREET, YOU WOULD THEN HAVE TO
HAVE A FACADE THAT LOOKS LIKE IT MADE SENSE UP ON THE STREET, SO
YOU HAVE TO HAVE WINDOWS, YOU HAVE TO HAVE --
>> YOU HAVE TO MAKE IT LOOK NICE.
>> NO, NO, WAIT A MINUTE. >> WE HAVE TO MAKE IT LOOK NICE.
>> BUT YOU ALSO HAVE TO HAVE ON THE SIDE WHERE PEOPLE ARE
PARKING, BETWEEN THEM AND THE RAILROAD AND THE BUILDING, YOU
HAVE TO HAVE ANOTHER WHOLE FACADE THAT LOOKS LIKE THE FRONT
AND THE LOADING PORT WOULD BE RIGHT BASICALLY IN THE PUBLIC'S
VIEW. >> I'M ASKING NOT TO HAVE IT
NECESSARILY FLUSH ON THE STREET, BUT AT LEAST SWAY SIDEWAYS.
WE ASKED HARRIS-TEETER TO DO THAT.
YOU GO PAST THERE, THEY HAVE WINDOWS ALL THE WAY AROUND IT
BECAUSE WE PLAYED HARD BALL WITH THEM AND WE SAID IF YOU WANT TO
COME, BUILD IT RIGHT. WHY AREN'T WE PLAYING HARDBALL
FOR THIS. >> THE TENANT WON'T COME.
IT'S NOT THEM. >> BUT YOU CAN PULL IT TO THE
SIDE. >> THEY WON'T COME.
>> WE JUST KNOW THAT THE GOURMET GROCERY NEEDS TO BE BACK HERE.
>> THESE PEOPLE CAN PICK THEIR --
>> YEAH, AND THEY GET A GOOD DEAL FROM US.
>> YOU CAN SEE THAT THE CONCERN HERE IS THERE'S 36 CARS IN THIS
PICTURE ALONE AND -- >> HAVE YOU EVER EATEN AT PASHA
AND YOU SIT OUTSIDE? >> YES, MA'AM.
>> AND THOSE TRAINS GO BY AND IT'S ABSOLUTELY GLORIOUS, IT'S
GREAT THERE. >> BUT IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE,
IT'S NOT THE DEVELOPER. IT'S THE TENANT, AND THE TENANT
WILL NOT COME IF HE CAN'T BE POSITIONS THE WAY THEY NEED TO
FOR THE PUBLIC. PAUL, I JUST WANT TO SAY, I
AGREE WITH EVERYTHING YOU SAID. I JUST WANT TO SAY, THOSE DEALS
YOU TALKED ABOUT, WE WERE ALL IN AGREEMENT ON, THAT WHAT WE HAD
TO DO, AND SO ALL I'M SAYING IS THAT AT THIS -- THIS IS ONE OF
THOSE DEALS THAT WE'RE DOING TO BUILD UP THAT CORRIDOR, THEN
LET'S UNDERSTAND THAT FROM THE OUTSET AND WE HAVE TO GIVE
CONCESSIONS ON THE FRONT END OR THE BACK END OR SOME TYPE OF
PERFORMANCE GRANT, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT IT SHOULDN'T BE, WELL,
WE UNDERSTAND GOING IN THAT THIS IS WHAT WE'RE DOING, BUT ANY OF
THOSE OTHER DEALS, WE'VE NEVER HAD TWO OR THREE PEOPLE THAT
HAVE BEEN AT THE TABLE BEFORE AND THEN COMPLAINING WELL,
WHY -- >> I GUESS PART OF MY CONCERN
ABOUT THAT, IS ONCE THEY BROUGHT THIS DEAL, I THINK WE SAID TAKE
IT TO THE BUSINESS ASSOCIATION, AND THE BUSINESS ASSOCIATION, BY
THE WAY, GOT A VOTE AND DESPITE AT LEAST ONE OF THEIR MEMBERS
TRYING TO GET THEM TO OPPOSE IT AND THEY WOULD NOT DO THAT.
ONCE YOU GET IT OUT THERE AND IT'S ALMOST LIKE WE TOOK -- AND
OTHER PEOPLE SAW THE DEAL AND SAID WAIT A MINUTE, I CAN DO
BETTER THAN THAT. AND I THINK THAT PUTS THE CITY
IN A POSITION OF TELLING THE GUY WHO BRINGS YOU A DEAL, WE LOOKED
AT HIS NUMBERS AND WE THINK IT MAKES SENSE, BUT THEN WE SAY YOU
GOT TO TAKE IT OUT TO THE PUBLIC AND TWO OTHER GUYS COME IN AND
SAY I'M GOING TO DO BETTER THAN THAT.
THAT'S LIKE TRYING TO SHOP THE DEAL ONCE THE DEAL HAS BEEN PUT
HERE AND I THINK THAT PUTS US IN A DIFFICULT POSITION AND THAT'S
ALL -- >> CAN WHY GO BACK TO THE
DESIGN -- WE GO BACK TO THE DESIGN REAL QUICK?
>> ALL THE DEVELOPERS WHO BROUGHT THIS HAVE SAID THE SAME
THING. MAYBE THERE CAN BE A BETTER WAY
AND I'M ALL FOR IT, BUT THEY ARE NOT -- THE GROCERY IS NOT GOING
TO COME, THEY WOULDN'T DO IT AT WARDS CORNER AND THEY WON'T DO
IT HERE. >> I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT GHENT,
IN IT'S HISTORICAL VALUE AND NATURE, MY CONCERN IS LOOKING
AT -- FROM THE STREET LEVEL, I WOULD HATE TO DRIVE BY THERE AND
JUST SEE AS FACILITY AND I KNOW THAT THERE'S TREES THERE, BUT I
MEAN, EVEN A BRICK WALL, YOU KNOW, ALONG THE ROAD THAT WOULD
KIND OF BREAK UP AND WITH SOME TREES AROUND IT AND I KNOW THIS
IS NOT FOR US TO MEDDLE IN HERE, BUT WHEN WE VOTE ON THIS, WE
HAVE TO TRUST THAT IT -- WHEN IT GOES TO DESIGN REVIEW, THAT
THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE THOSE SUGGESTIONS AND I THINK OUR
CONCERNS SHOULD BE HEARD. I AGREE WITH TERRI, THIS AREA IN
PARTICULAR, YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE JUST ASPHALT, AND THEN A
STORE. I UNDERSTAND THAT THAT'S WHAT
THE TENANT IS LOOKING FOR, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU WANT TO
PRESERVE THE COMMUNITY FEEL AND THE LOOK OF GHENT AND CONTINUE
GROWING BECAUSE THIS IS SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO BE
THERE FOR A VERY LONG TIME. AND WHEN YOU GO OUT TO WHOLE
FOODS AND OUT IN VIRGINIA BEACH AND IT GOT ASPHALT, YOU CAN'T
TELL. THAT STORY IS SO CLASSY LOOKING
AND THAT DESIGN, IT ALMOST DOESN'T LOOK LIKE A STORE.
>> THAT'S A GREAT COMMENT AND WE NEED TO LET THE DESIGN PROCESS
DO THAT AND I THINK THEY WILL DO SOMETHING IN FRONT THAT WILL
SHIELD. WE TALKED ABOUT THAT WHEN WE HAD
A PRESENTATION OF THIS PROJECT. >> WE DIDN'T HAVE THE WHOLE --
>> YES, WE DID. >> I ASKED FRANK ABOUT DESIGN
STANDARDS ON THAT. [ INAUDIBLE COMMENTS ]
>> THE LDDC AND THE PLANNING DIRECTOR HAS TO REVIEW AND
APPROVE THE DESIGN AND THAT MEANS I'LL BE ABLE TO TAKE THIS
THROUGH THAT PROCESS AND GET THEIR INPUT FROM THE DESIGN
REVIEW COMMITTEE. I HEARD WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT THE
LOW WALL, THAT IS AN ISSUE I SPOKE TO CHUCK ABOUT AND I
TALKED TO RAY AND I THINK WE CAN WORK THROUGH THE DESIGN AND I
WOULD AGREE WITH YOU THAT SOMETHING LIKE A LOW WALL TO
MAINTAIN THE STREET SPACE IN COMBINATION WITH SOME BLENDING
WILL HELP OBSCURE THAT PARKING AND WILL ADDRESS BOTH OUR GOALS
AS WELL AS WHAT FRESH MARKET HAS SAID THEY WANT.
>> I MEAN, EVEN OVER AT -- ON THE CORNER OF 21st AND COLLEY,
WHAT IS IT THE RITE-AID -- >> THE WALGREENS?
>> THEY PUT A WALL IN THERE ON THE CORNER, YOU KNOW.
THEY PUT A WALL IN THERE TO SHIELD, TO IMPROVE -- I NOTICED
THAT THIS WEEKEND. >> WHERE THAT IS?
>> THE WALGREENS. >> BUT THE WALGREENS IS ALSO ON
THE STREET. >> NO --
>> NOT A COLLEY, IT'S -- >> IT'S GOT ITS SIDE TO IT.
>> THAT'S ALL I ASKED FOR, WAS ON THE SIDE.
>> SHE WANTS TO TURN THAT BUILDING.
>> I DIDN'T WANT IT ALL THE WAY UP.
I JUST SAID TURN IT. THEY COULD DO THAT.
>> BUT WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT IT --
>> I GUESS WHAT I'M SAYING IS, WHEN FRANK SAYS THEY'RE GOING TO
DO THAT, BUT IF WE'RE VOTING THIS, WE DON'T HAVE ANY
SAFEGUARDS THEY'RE GOING TO ACCEPT THAT.
>> YES, MA'AM. IT'S A DESIGN THAT WE DON'T
APPROVE OR LIKE, WE HAVE CONTROL OVER THAT.
>> BUT WE DON'T. WE'RE NOT VOTING IT.
>> BUT I THINK WE'RE TELLING STAFF WHAT WE WANT.
>> WE DO HAVE -- WE'VE HAD MR. GENDROSS OUT TO LOOK AT IT
AND TALK ABOUT THE CHARACTER OF THE 21st AREA.
>> JUST TODAY, ROBYN THOMAS ACROSS THE STREET IS REALLY
HAPPEN AND IT'S A GOOD-LOOKING CORRIDOR AND THEY'RE ANXIOUS TO
HAVE THIS STORE. I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE THIS KIND
OF STORE, DON'T GET ME WRONG, BUT WE ONLY GOT ONE SHOT AT THIS
AND YOU DON'T DO IT RIGHT -- >> THE COMMUNITY IS
OVERWHELMINGLY IN FAVOR OF IT. >> WE ALL ARE.
EVERYBODY WANTS IT. ROBYN THOMAS'S DEVELOPMENT NEEDS
THIS. I JUST AM ASKING, PLEASE MAKE
SURE THAT YOU'RE NOT JUST GIVING IT AWAY.
YOU GOT A CHANCE HERE. WE'RE A GOOD PLACE TO BE HERE.
PEOPLE WANT TO COME. >> WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO GO
UPSTAIRS IN A MOMENT. >> WHO IS ROBYN THOMAS --
>> SHE'S THE ARCHITECT. >> AND WHERE IS SHE LOCATED.
>> SHE'S DONE THAT DEVELOPMENT THERE ON 21st STREET, ACROSS
FROM AND UP -- >> THE WHOLE TIME WE TALK ABOUT
IT, WHETHER IT WAS IN COMMITTEE, I'VE NOT SEEN IT ON THE FLOOR,
WE HAD SAID THAT RAY GENDRSS HAS TO GET INVOLVED AND COME UP WITH
SOME TREATMENT ON THAT STREET, BE IT A WALL, A COMBINATION THAT
FITS IN TO THE GHENT GROUP, I MEAN, TO THE GHENT MOTIF OR THE
HISTORY PROJECT. THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN PART.
>> IT WASN'T PRESENTED TONIGHT. IT WAS NOT UNTIL WE FOUGHT FOR
IT. I NEED THESE GUARANTEES AND I
WILL GO AHEAD WITH THIS IF YOU CAN GUARANTEE THIS, BUT I DON'T
KNOW THAT I HAVE THOSE GUARANTEES FROM YOU.
AND SO I'M VOTING FOR THIS AND THEN YOU GUYS CAN SAY, WELL, WE
TRIED AND IT DIDN'T WORK. SO THEN WHAT?
>> IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN FORCE THE DESIGN TO COME BEFORE US?
>> WE'VE ALREADY SEEN THE PROJECT.
WE HAD A PRESENTATION, SAW THE PROJECT, LOOKED AT THE BAYS --
>> WE HAVEN'T SEEN THIS. WE DIDN'T SEE A WALL.
[ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> WE TALKED ABOUT -- YOU MADE A
QUESTION ABOUT THE BAYS RESPECT. [ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ]
>> RAY IS GOING TO -- >> ANDY, YOU WANT TO WRAP IT UP
FOR US. >> WE HAVE TO HAVE FAITH IN OUR
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