OBPA Board Meeting 12 13 12 Part 4

Uploaded by TheOBPA on 01.01.2013


(idle conversation - unintelligible)
Okay, we're on? Okay, we're still part of our regular
budget meeting, but now that meeting has ended, so now we're going to go to a
Personnel Committee Meeting, and then I'll turn it over to
you, Fred? Okay, the committee report, Mr. Chairman, is
I'm going to need an Executive Session in regards to some personnel issues,
and labor contract discussions,
regarding the labor people here, the union.
So, I need a motion to go into Executive Session
for a brief time. Okay.
I'll make that motion. I'll second it.
All in favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
Okay. So, we need a short...[break].
I'm going to need to report to you on that. Okay.
Well, today is Thursday,
December 13, 2012.
The time is now 7:03 P.M. For those who
are following our day agenda, we started at 1:30 with a Budget Hearing Meeting,
And, now we have moved forward [to]
our regular Board Meeting for this particular date.
I'll call the meeting to order. Wade, do you have any letters
of communication to the Board? There are several things in your board read packet,
I will be brief, and we'll go through each of them.
On your board packet, on top of the file, is a
draft statement that has been updated since it was presented in the same
format in September. Please review that at your leisure.
The second item in there, is an update
an interim update from Fisher Associates. There's the
charts, graphs, and a couple of neat things that you should
take a look at there. The 3rd item in the packet
is a letter that relates to unfinished business.
(unintelligible) Regarding the
Time Warner easement.
The next item is a recommended practice from the authority's budget office,
which was discussed. The next item is the authority's budget office,
reviewing the website. There's a letter in there
from the attorney, on the grade crossing case.
The part in the (unintelligible) feedback from Dede Scozzafava,
on the Northern Border Regional Commission.
Correspondence to the State of New York, regarding
the Office for Prevention of Domestic Violence.
And, several news articles that have occurred
throughout the period, Mr. Chairman.
I'd be happy to answer any questions. That was nice to receive
a letter from Mrs. Scozzafava. Any more recommendations in regard
to that process? No, unfortunately
the Northern Border Regional Commission process that is
there's a huge need there, with a very small pot of money.
We will submit something the next time
that comes around.
There's no inside information here. It was a valid
application that obviously didn't make it
through. (unintelligible) That's correct.
Mr. Chairman, in the communication stuff, what's this Fisher thing?
What are they telling us here? That is an interim update, they'll be here,
I'm sorry, in the interest of time, I forgot to tell you the other half of the story. Those are some of the
documents that are in graph form, that you will see
Fisher and Associates present in it's final form,
at the January 16th
Board Meeting. Which I won't be at. Has it's update on
the Proctor Avenue parcel, this parcel, and the parcel at the
corner of 812, and 37. You tell about all the things that, possibilities here.
Right, but I'm not going to be at that meeting, I'm going to be in Texas. (cross talk - unintelligible)
What is this National Register listing site?
It is, this building has a potential
number, that we decided to go that route.
Because, there's already a number on file, for this building.
What Mr. Carter's referring to is...(interrupts) What does that mean to us?
Well, that's one thing that,
it would be appropriate to have the...(cross talk - unintelligible) website
at the meeting, it opens some opportunities, it also creates some problems.
Yeah. That's where that started from.
Yeah. (cross talk - unintelligible)
It opens up the grants sometimes, but then it really limits you on what you can do.
Do you have any comments? I didn't know if you
we're talking about this? No, I was asking Steve about the location, it's another topic. Oh, okay.
My mouth was quite a bit smaller. (chuckles) Yeah. (unintelligible)
Anything else in regards to that?
No. Okay. I need approval
of the board minutes from the meeting held on November 5th, 2012?
So moved. Second. Any discussion?
No further discussion. All those in favor, signify
by saying aye? Aye. Ayes have it.
Do we have any comments, or presentations by citizens, or anything
from the media? Yes? No?
Okay, let's go to staff reports.
Wade? It's been a very busy month. First and foremost,
I'd like to thank staff, including Fred Morrill,
for an excellent job on the budget package.
A lot of work; time and efforts done in there, from all members of staff.
It's greatly appreciated, nice job, Fred.
A couple other things that have gone on through the period, we've opened communications with the city,
on a number of areas where we can work together. We have another
meeting coming up on the 17th. There is a
lease of the border station, GSA, SLA, number 15. What that is,
it's a government label for supplemental lease agreement.
What this means to us is, $64,000 for
border station, and,
the border patrol being located at the border station.
The digital sign, as I mentioned, will be
in place December 19th.
Other things; Labor Management Committee was held. We had a meeting
of the Governance Committee. Some items were referred to the board for action,
some items were referred to legal for review.
We had a meeting of the Personnel Committee. There's some new action items,
on the agenda tonight from that.
The MWBE Authorities
conference call, we participated in that.
A domestic violence policy was put together.
We continue to advocate for the approach span project on the bridge.
On the port side of things, over on page 4,
the Army Corps of Engineers formal feasibility study of
quote/unquote deepening, as opposed to dredging. There's 2 separate meetings
to report, is available
tonight, and on the agenda. That's important, because that's a
culmination of efforts, including efforts
in conjunction with our Chairman, to move this along,
and this is a very important
thing, that will get us the formal report that we need
for dredging, or deepening to occur in the Port of Ogdensburg.
Had a conference call with FAA;
their ADO, in relation to the runway
options, obstruction removal, and mitigation.
The engineer is working on something there.
One of the things that's not on this report, I had the opportunity
to attend the St. Lawrence Seaway Canadian version,
and the U.S. version, reception in Montreal last Thursday.
I met some pretty interesting people there,
we've got some follow up that we need to do there. 2 parcel transfers
have been complete for private individuals on Ford Street.
There's additional things that we'll talk about next time
in Executive Session.
It has just been an incredibly busy month, and I'd be happy
to answer any questions that you have. I have one little note on the
sign. Things I've noted, and things I was looking at,
this shut off time?
Do you remember talking of the shut off time?
I mean, at 1 o'clock in the morning, who's driving by at 1 o'clock in the morning? You're just burning juice. We may be.
It's an LED light that doesn't use much power
at all, really. And, we had planned on just letting it
run, and cycling the ads. Okay.
Okay, just threw it out there.
Are there any more questions for Wade?
Okay. Well, I haven't heard much from you
today, (laughter) Mr. Chief Financial Officer. No. (laughter)
only 5 and a half hours we're here today, so I want to thank you for spending time with us.
Actually, before you give your report, I concur with what Mr. Davis
just said. Looking at all the numbers and figures, and the things that you;
our staff put together. A very extensive report,
and it's very clear, too. It's good to understand
it's a big part. And, I really appreciate the job that all of our staff
[and] what they've done. How they've served with the port. You've really managed that money,
and how it really operates for the whole year. And, that's really,
as much as the report is one thing, what you do, and how you handle the money, is obviously much more
important. So, I really congratulate you and the staff,
good job; well done. Thank you.
I've got the financial report, the bridge report, and the airport report. We'll look at those last,
because they're behind the sheet. Under compliance,
I did some web-based training for MWBE.
Ten year capital plan was resubmitted to the division of budget, because of some
things that it lacked in the format, and so on.
The budget must be inputted into Paris by December 31st.
I'll be on to that, first thing next week.
And preliminary budget figures were provided to the division of budget on December 6th.
I'd like to now go down to other.
There's a lot of things going on, as you can imagine.
But, one thing that I would like to point out, is something that happened
on Thanksgiving week.
I decided that on Wednesday of Thanksgiving, at noon,
that I was going to go home, and take that afternoon off.
And, I didn't really go home. I decided to go to
the Woodchop Shop, and buy a
new chainsaw. While I was in the Woodchop Shop at 3 o'clock,
my cell phone rang.
The temporary payroll clerk had just learned from
the ILA union chief, (he's not really the president)
but from Mr. Putney that,
the union people that had been working that period
had not been paid. And, it was 3 o'clock Wednesday.
And, of course everyone was paid on Wednesday, normally we pay on Thursday.
She asked me what to do about
that. What we found out later happened with the
communications between the clock failed. And, that the
other hours had been input manually,
prior to the end of the period.
I told her that I would
approve the hours that Mr. Putney provided to us, and then we would
correct it in the next payroll. I told her that
we had never done an extra payroll for paychecks.
Whatever that cost, we would pay.
But, you get a hold of them, and find out how to do it.
And, third but not least, was the fact that UPS was not delivering here on Friday,
because we were not going to be here. And, I told her she had to get over to UPS, and ask them
to deliver on Friday, since they would be delivering at other places around here.
So, she had 3 duties there to take care of,
that was at 3 o'clock. I called
at 3:30, to talk to her,
she how she was coming. And, she did not want to talk to me, she was talking
to Paychex, and that she'd get back to me very soon. At 3:45,
she called me,
and they had been paid. 45 minutes.
I just thought it was...
really good work, and you should know.
I came in Friday to make sure
that in case UPS didn't get the message, that there was someone here
to go to Potsdam, and get the checks. The checks came in
around noontime. We got ahold of ILA,
and the people came and got their checks, and were quite grateful.
Excellent. That's great. Good job. That was good work.
Now, let's look at the reports.
First is financial page.
Page 6. Wade, before you get started, I think in the compliance
element, I think we need to, for the public to really
understand this item, and with the
type of things that we're dealing with, and how we're handling this type of problem,
what it all means to us. Right.
MWBE is a real challenge.
The goals, as you know, have been moved up to 10%.
MBE and 10% WBE for
a 20% goal, that all of our contracts
and spending will come...20% of them will come
from MWBEs, minority women owned businesses.
I think that
we had had that policy with numbers where we upped it
to 10%. Because we had...
you know, you discussed it in here. That was your choices.
Based on our location in the state, and so on.
The people that, Empire State Development that run the
MWBE program, have said that...
that the availability of
MWBE organizations within
our region, doesn't matter. There available statewide,
and we need to find ways to make the 20% goal
which you just set. So, we're struggling, we're doing
the best we can. Like I said, it's a tremendous challenge.
And, we're going to be working with
the people in the MWBE organization at the state,
and with some people at dank (?) that have had some experience
with this, and get our numbers up as well as we can.
But, it's a real challenge, and it's a real time consuming challenge,
in that....we have to learn about how to
do it properly. We have to submit reports.
And, we have to try to find ways to increase our MWBE
utilization. And, all of those things combined,
the compliance, the understanding,
and the improvement in our
it's extremely time consuming. I'm aware of this,
and Wade and I talked about it the other day, there's a press release
that's going to come out about certain agencies, and how we are rated.
Our potential to get those numbers
is almost, I would say, slightly impossible.
But, we're working toward it. And, maybe somebody looks at it, [and thinks] we're not in favor of
hiring minorities or women, and doing those types of things. We are,
we are trying to do all those type of things, but the completion factor is
much more difficult to get. Right.
I think we feel need to preempt that, so that you at least know
that if does come forth, that we'll go from there.
Thank you. Yeah. Well, to kind of put just one final thought
on that, to kind of put some metrics around that:
we're talking about compliance numbers from one quarter at 7%. The next quarter
is 2% on average. We're down around 5% compliance overall.
Against a 20% goal. And, this is with every effort
that we have, trying to find the...
folks that we need for the MWBE, to make this happen.
It's going to be very difficult for us, but we'll continue.
Well, we've talked about it. What is realistic,
buying, or having somebody provide a service.
And then, all of the sudden, have that service come from downstate someplace,
to meet that quotient. And, all of the sudden you realize that was an extra (and I'll just use a fictitious number)
20, $30,000 more than we should have spent. I mean, that
just doesn't make sense to use public funds [with] that approach and way.
But, I'm not sure how that will play out in the governance office
to see exactly how we meet those mandates, but time will tell.
We'll do the best we can to follow the guidelines,
get the performance numbers up. Are there any counties
associated with not getting there? Not that we're aware of.
A slap on the hand?
Maybe not being a high priority for funding. I don't know.
(cross talk - unintelligible) Yeah, that would be a worry. It could be something
that I haven't seen, that we have no idea what the penalties are. So, we just keep striving
to do the best we can. I think the City of Ogdensburg is dealing with the same issue,
aren't they, Fred? I don't know that elected
organizations like that are required to do that.
Oh, okay. It may be coming in the future, but I don't think
it is yet. Okay.
Okay, on page 6 is the finances,
here to date, November.
You can see that most things
are up here. Bridge tolls are strong,
rental income is 135,000
over the budgeted amount. Where, operating income, of course with the wind project
is way over.
And, going down through, the revenue is
1.5 million dollars of the budget. On the expense side,
the same things that are way up, are also driven by
the wind turbine project.
So, we're doing well,
and we know why.
On page 7...oh, is there any questions?
Where would we get...
I don't want to say criticism....somebody asks us the question: how many ships
did you have...port here?
I mean, obviously it's reported, and we show that. But, I think last year...Steve
was it 1, 2, 3? I forgot how many ships. It was before December,
and the salt ships. Remember the number last year, and all of the sudden this year...
I don't hear anybody saying anything, where there's criticism...(interrupts): I'd have to say,
Fred, between the ships, and then the salt ships,
that's really all we had last year. And then,
I want to say it might be 8, or 9 (unintelligible) ships, and the salt ships.
And then, with the wind mill project,
we've had 5 vessels so far.
And, we had the Navy one, too. The Navy, and then 4 cruise ships.
17, 18, 19? Yeah,
it would be close to 20. That's an awesome year. Yeah.
It really is. We picked up, with that locomotive
and some returns. We had 2 boats that had here with returning items
from the wind mill project that we weren't counting on. We did the locomotives,
and sent out some other things on that boat.
And then, another boat stopped with returns from a project going back to Europe.
And those were 2 extras that...(interrupts): Now, does that count the U.S.
Navy ship? Yeah. I couldn't find the...(cough- unintelligible)
We'll get that done up as part of the port report.
Yeah, sure. That's good information.
And, there's a fella that was writing in to the paper, it seemed like every other week.
Yeah. (chuckles) That's weird. We haven't heard anything from him, have we? Now we haven't.
The airport activity report,
you can see November was strong at the airport.
972 passengers.
So, we're 42% over last year in passengers,
and we're 40.5% over in enplanements.
On the fuel sales side, we've gone up to
48% over last year.
At 22,000 gallons. October was huge.
November was very strong too, but it wasn't as good as October.
A lot of this Jet A sales for the helicopter.
The medical helicopter, but that isn't the only thing that was used.
We had a lot of student
I think some of the parents weekend brought in a lot of planes, and they fueled up.
We've had really good fuel sales.
And then...
the bridge traffic report, you can see
auto crossings are up 22.5% in November.
I think you're seeing that down at the UPS store.
Along with Wal Mart, and everything else.
So, it was 20% including the trucks. Trucks were also up,
Almost 2%.
This is a real good indication that
the bridge traffic is staying in front. I think one of the reasons that it was
up 20%, is that it seemed to be (unintelligible) throughout November,
and I don't know why that was. You can see in November, we had
about the same, just a little bit more than October. But last year, we were down quite a bit.
22.5% is really...
Any questions about any of the reports?
Any more questions for Fred?
Mr. Chairman,
our patience for Director Mr. Lawrence,
in the industrial development, and he's not here tonight. I certainly wish him
a speed recovery from the flu.
It's been a very busy period, as I mentioned before.
Some of the things John's been working on, is following up on wind turbine projects,
for future years.
Looking at new bulk material. A renewal of a contract with
a customer. I'm meeting with a large customer
regarding the new product that we have in the port, Clearlane product.
Outreach to several logistics firms.
A couple of T hangar leases.
First draft of the website redesign, has been sent
back and forth a couple times, since this was...
put together. There is a new video commercial
that, again, if he were here, we'd have this on display,
but we'll get that for next time. The authority has a commercial now, and that's done,
and it's a very impressive commercial. And, it will be part of our website, going forward.
Under industrial development and promotion, there was
a data package that had come through the county from
a Canadian company that was collecting a site review.
That information was completed. The 5,000 piece mailing
to Montreal went out. I do know, so far
out of that 5,000 piece mailing, there have been 4 visits
scheduled on that.
There's a new ad campaign on WPBS.
North Country Public Radio Sponsorship. I'm sure you've heard
that on the radio. DCG Corplan
has submitted the final draft of the Greek yogurt prospectus. I know John is in the process
of doing some additional edits on that, and sending it back,
for additional work. Following on that,
from DCG Corplan is the international headquarters and logistics cluster.
He's interfaced a lot with IDA, during the
period, specifically on some sales calls.
He's participated in the
meeting with the City of Ogdensburg, to see where we can work together to foster growth.
And, the...
Montreal Gazette is back. There's been
109 clicks on the website. And, the industry average
click through rate is .05%. Our overall average
was .24%.
And, he mentions here that despite the better than average response rate,
there hasn't been a lead through there yet.
This doesn't mean that there isn't leads. Some of the things he's working on,
coming up in the near future, is the text message for the website
redesign. Of course, there's the joint meeting with the city coming up.
Marketing the Greek yogurt prospectus, and getting that out.
Finalizing the international business and logistics prospectus.
And of course, always working to retain,
and expand businesses here in the park.
The availability report, over on page 11, you can see
that we have a 36% vacancy rate at the port.
I'm sorry, in the park. And, you can see where that's
originating from on that page. On page 12,
you can see that the bridge and administration building
is 100% occupied. And, the majority of the port buildings are
occupied, as well.
I'd be happy to relay any questions that you have on this,
on this report, you can email, or email John,
and we'll make sure we follow up. I'd like to talk about the Greek yogurt, for a minute.
I've been waiting for you all day.
(laughter) I've been here since 1:30 waiting for your report! (laughter)
I've rowed through 9 miles of water. (laughter)
I hope I don't disappoint. (laughter) Please do, Steve, thank you.
In the industrial park on building #3,
that's where we've started on our energy conservation. What we're doing is replacing
old T12, which are inch and a half bulbs,
with T8, which is a 1 inch bulb, and they're more energy efficient,
and the T12s are not going to be manufactured.
So, at the end of this week, we should have that done,
and we'll be moving on to other parts of the park.
We just kind of do that as our fill in time,
for the winter. So, it's been going pretty good the last 2 winters.
To the Border Station, we're responsible, we're cleaning the...
warehouse, so we did a quarterly clean with that.
On the bridge, you're aware that the message board will be
installed on the 19th. And, we spent quite a bit
of time, right around Thanksgiving, and a little after doing
Christmas decorations. At the airport,
CNS is doing a final of draft of the airport wildlife
hazard management. And, that's been an ongoing thing,
that's going to result from the survey they did a year ago.
And, we're revising and updating, and submitting to TSA
the airport security plan. At the port,
so far, we've shipped out approximately
19,000 tons now. As a rule, we usually have 1 boat
gone by now, which would be roughly 25 to 27,000 tons.
So, it's been kind of slow as far as moving out, but as you all know,
it's really a weather driven thing. Everybody's stocked up from last spring.
And, the weather's been
relatively mild. We did receive a boat last Sunday,
it was the Canadian Progress, that delivered 27,000 tons
of North American salt. And, we're working out of that pile to load out
to North American customers. Building P8
has been cleaned, and emptied. And, we're ready for
a large shipment of grain from the railroad,
coming this winter. (unintelligible)
We utilized building #5,
where the Cargill Clearlane salt, that had to be stored indoors,
and we've gone the whole length of that with...
with all of that salt. And, it will work for us.
It's a good utilization of that, and it will be cleaned by springtime.
At the Port Access Road, the scale house
is in place. And, foundation work was completed,
A good part of the corner blocked the...
the trailers that transported are still under the foundation. They've got to lower the
building off of those, onto the block that's been installed,
and they're going to do that at the beginning of next week. And then, finish up the
foundation, or the block wall.
My maintenance people are
busy doing all the utilities; the electrical work, and the heating,
and the plumbing. So, within another week,
10 days, we should a lot of it pretty well
wrapped up. Another thing on the
Port Access Road, the streetlight; the power has been installed,
and Syracuse signal was supposed to be in here this week,
they were expecting today, but I haven't heard anything from them.
But, they'll hook everything up, and then,
we've discussed...and I really don't know the process of how they'll do that. I'm sure they know.
As you know, there's some standing signs,
that show. There's a traffic light now. And, there's black plastic
over that. Maybe they might have a certain process,
you've got to go through, just to get the public used to what's there. And, until
the scale house is up and functioning, we won't be opening up
the Port Access Road, until that's ready to go.
Once that's ready to go, Wall Street will be opening, and so will the port,
during working hours, we'll work everything out on that.
But, right now, maybe they'll say, in week or so,
you can turn the light on, and then people coming from Barre Street will trip the light.
So that people will get used to that.
To be honest with you, I'm not sure of how the actual process, but I think there's something
where you can acclimate the public to going through there.
That would be a good suggestion that they do that.
I think it should be turned on, and put in proper order, and when they come up Barre Street,
they'll trigger it. People will start getting used to that light being there. Right. Even if
it's blinking. I don't know. They may...that's what Wade and I talked about. That they may say,
"Well, let's start off with a blinking red light"...
And, you know, you've got to approach it from Barre Street, a blinking red light on
Barre Street, and yellow. And, people will just have to wait for...
maybe they'll suggest a week or 10 days. And then they may say, "Go ahead and switch it over,
so that the green lights work." That's a good idea. And then, when we're ready to go,
it will just be a matter of moving those barricades.
I just don't want a kind of incident, once we open that up.
Just because, that was one of the reasons we kind of closed that off, just to keep
traffic out of there until we're ready to go. I think it would be nice to
if they turn it on a certain way that, it will get the people used to it.
Let Barre Street control, if nobody comes up it, the light won't change. Right.
At least it will start blinking and changing, and the people start seeing it.
I'm going to rely a little bit on
Syracuse safety, or the signal people. I'm sure they do this all the time,
and maybe even direct me to a proper procedure,
with that. And then, the city will be taking that over, so I want to just check with
them to make sure, maybe there's something there that they suggest.
Rather than creating any kind of problem for them.
Yeah, because they usually have to set a policy up, what they want the light
to do, or not to do. And then, they're going to be taking control of the of the lease on that, right?
Yeah, we'll check into it, but there's probably going to have to be
some sort of formal resolution from this board, turning the signal over
to the City of Ogdensburg at some point, and we'll address that as we
get a little bit closer to it.
Any questions on that?
In building P4,
the new overhead door openings were installed last week, and the new overhead doors were installed Tuesday.
So, we kind of increased the...
the usability of the building, by putting 2 doors on the
northeast side. Before they were on the south side.
And, if we had any kind of activity, whether it's grain, railcars, or salt,
it kind of prohibited anybody...for example now, if Hoosiers use that,
we have to keep a slot open for it. Right now, it's not going to be a problem this winter,
because there's nothing there. But, if we needed to use that for salt,
they wouldn't have to be bothered with that, they could go around the other side, and they could just...
it's just a mirror image on the backside, of 2 new doors, but it will really improve
the utilization of the building, so we'll finished that this week.
On other things,
every December, or November-December, I've got to do annual outfall sampling.
We have 6 outfalls at the port, and I do that
sampling and send it to Atlantic Testing, they test all of that, and they have helped me
with the airport, and with the port with the outfalls.
We've got to monitor, that's part of our permitting, so we did that.
And, that's about it.
Steve, how far along are we with anything on...
unloading these grain cars
directly into the building with the conveyor. Have we done anything on that?
I haven't really had the opportunity.
This winter we might, but...
I don't know, I'll have to see with that. What I'm planning on doing...
(interrupts) I thought when we
redid the rail line, that new rail line along the building,
that was one of the issues that we wanted to do. To be able to load off the railcars
on the conveyor, and go directly into the building. Yeah.
We haven't used....I think there's 2 doors on that
side, and we haven't put any kind of platform, where we were thinking
of breaking through that. Is it an issue you don't want to do? Is it an issue that shouldn't do?
No. It's just, we really haven't the opportunity on
a large scale. With what we can move it over with the truck...
we could look at it with this...we're supposed to get
an (unintelligible) meal in there with a bundle.
And, it was something where, maybe we can bring a railcar to the front of P8,
and drop it right there, and just take it right in there.
But, as far as going directly in there, we haven't got anything in there
where we can take the conveyor from the
building side, and just, want to go underneath, it's not level enough. We haven't got anything in there.
I just really haven't had time. Is it a bad thing to do? No.
No, it would be a great thing to do. It's just, to be honest, I just haven't gotten around
to getting anything set up with that part of it.
And, up until now really, we were going to...
a lot of that was just go into building #2. If it's not a good issue,
if it's not a good thing to do, I keep harping about it,
and asking about it, but I never see anything happening. No, I honestly just
with everything going on, I have to take out those barricades on the inside,
and cut them loose. And then, open up the door, and then you've got to put some kind of
platform right there where we want to do it, so we can come in from the
building side, and go right up underneath that. But, I just haven't...
it's just something that I haven't gotten to.
But, that would be something we could
work on. So, it's better to do it the way you're doing it? I don't know.
If we could eliminate the
truck transport, and just take it off with a loader and...
I was thinking, you know, right in front, where you go right through between 2, and 8, do you know where I'm talking about?
Yes. You'd bring a railcar right there, and just offload it
right in front of the building, and put it right inside. The only thing is, you're putting it on...
you're weather dependent. If it's dry out there, you're fine. Or not too windy.
You know, you've got to pick your days.
So, you could offload...just move a couple railcars ahead, and offload them right there, without having to
have a truck every time. It sounds like
a good issue. We'll put it on the agenda for the Facilities Committee,
for periodic reports. One that we'll look at, and nail it down.
I've got one question, that ship that came in the other day, unloading salt.
Do we have to move that from where it is, over around?
It depends on if North American's got
one more to come in, we do. Okay. We don't have to move all of it,
but, what I try to do is save them some money, and I put this out to all the salt companies,
when that dock is clear...
I want to entice them into saying, "Go ahead, put your last load
on there, and we'll load every truck that comes in for the next month."
And get it off the dock, directly out. And, it saves them
that, what is it? A buck thirty relocation, something like that?
So, if it's not clear, and someone goes, "Can you take it?"
Yeah, we might be able to, and we might not.
We get that organized and covered, what's out there now, and it's clear on the point,
and so, I think North American might be able to bring another one in.
It's kind of just an incentive for us. But, if we knew,
everyone said, "No, we're not bringing one in". We'd just leave it, and we'll work right out
of that pile, and probably by mid-January, it's gone. But, straight out of the gate,
not relocated. We try to minimize that. The trucks that are moving salt down there,
Ray Green's trucks? 2 of them are, the other one is the one we own.
Okay. Who's manning the Green's trucks?
The ILA. We're just
renting the trucks bare, and we've got ILA guys driving those.
Do we have 4? Excuse me? Do we have 4 longshoremen working?
No, in that process...
we've got 4 extra, and with our guys. So, we have 2 loader guys,
and then 3 truck drivers, which are the ILA guys
running the trucks. So, we're going to be able to
generate enough revenue to pay all that cost? Yeah.
So, we pay bare cost on the rental of the truck,
and then also, with our extra truck, of course you've got
paperwork, but it's not a rental. But, we move it, we can move more salt,
without renting that extra truck.
I think it's a little...(interrupts): Kind of a break-even
situation? Yeah, I don't think it's...I think it's more than pays [for itself] we still make money on it.
And, we're still put employees to work. Yeah, exactly.
They're happy with that work. Which they haven't had in a long time. Right.
And, we have control of the work, it often depends on...sometimes, when you've got
that relief. That's good. Yeah. The company in the area is making a little money,
we're renting their truck, and the ILA is making money out of driving it. Right.
Good. That sounds good.
The press ain't here to write it. Call them, Sam, get them in here.
(chuckles) Oh my God. Here you are waiting hours,
(laughter - cross talk - unintelligible)
He said, I didn't get to bed 'til 3:30, and here I am up at 7! I said, 3:30?
I watch T.V. (laughter)
I think we can go by the committee reports, I think we can just move forward.
Are there committee reports to get into? I don't think so, do we?
Relevant items, Personnel Committee, and Governance Committee is moved back.
Relevant items are on the business items for tonight,
and others have been deferred, and (unintelligible)
Okay. All right, so we have unfinished business...
the approval of entry agreement with Time Warner Cable.
Yes, you'll recall, the last time we talked about Time Warner Cable,
specifically, on page 15, there's a better map there
that shows where it's going. This is going to...
Strader-Ferris. You'll see a
Strader-Ferris letter of support, a board read file
the 3rd one in.
I make a motion to approve the resolution. Second.
What was the reason we tabled that, exactly?
The reason it was tabled, the map
needed to be a better map. There was questions raised about what do we charge other
folks. Okay, this map and all approved?
The cost and everything? As far as the cost information,
John has that. This agreement
in its current form has no cost. We have not charged
Time Warner in the past, when it's been for the benefit
of one of our tenants. Okay.
Any further questions, comments?
No? All those in favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
Over on page 16,
kind of a new one. Could you walk us through that, please? Sure.
Kind of a new one, with the changes that were made,
tonight, or this afternoon.
And, as hard as Tisha and I worked to get this right, I think
there's one number that needs changing. And, that is under
the port, the last number that's 1,198,000 should be
253? Yeah, one million two fifty-three, in brackets.
That's a negative number. And, this shows the difference
where we increased the revenue by 60,000.
Increased the capital purchases by 55,000,
so that the 83,500 previous entry. It's the number that changes...
Ramona, is under the 4th, the last number,
is 1,253,814.
I thought you said you were going to take that from the bridge, though.
I gave the extra revenue to the bridge, yes. Okay. But, the extra capital is on the...
(interrupts): Oh, I see what you did. (continues): so that the capital was in the port.
So, that's the changes. I'll move that.
We have a motion, we need a second. I'll second. Ramona seconds.
Any further discussions?
Okay, all those in favor...do you want to do a roll call here?
Yeah, let's do a roll call.
It's important. Who's next?
I'll start it. Okay. Mr. LaMacchia? Yes.
Mr. Carter? Yes. Miss Breen? Yes.
Mr. Hooper? Yes. Mr. Loffler? Yes.
Okay, the next item is over on page 17. Agenda item A2 is approval of a
supplemental lease agreement with the Ogdensburg Chamber of Commerce.
For the period January 1, through December 31, 2013.
At the rates, terms, and conditions you see before you.
There's also a map on page 18, that shows the location.
Now, nothing has changed from the
other agreement, right? That we have with them? Nothing.
That's correct. But, I see one thing, is it still up in the air, whether they're going to
stay, or go, or what are they going to do?
What I'm asking is...
we've got a good thing with these folks, We want to keep them here. But yet, I don't want to miss
an opportunity to fill that building, fill that space,
with somebody that wants to come in for 5, or 6 years.
But, I don't want to be hanging there all the time.
What did they have the last time, a couple year agreement,
or a 3 year agreement, or what? A 1 year agreement. They've been year-to-year since they've been
with us. Did they want a longer agreement?
No, in this case, they actually wanted a shorter agreement, but wound up settling for a 1 year agreement.
I'm just asking as a board member. Is this something that we should
tell John to put on his agenda to fill?
Because it looks like they're going to leave us anyway, and I don't want to miss
an opportunity...because that's a beautiful office space. It is.
Absolutely beautiful. They can't go to the Community Center. They cannot go
to the Dobisky Center. Not without a change in state legislation.
No, that's not going to happen. Well, I think one of the things that's happening here is,
you think of our business model that you put up, you two, with the...
Breckenridge Building. Is that office space
and create a network of space over there. It's not that
we don't have a place that we can identify. That was your motive,
(unintelligible) Yes. That space over there?
This lease agreement does not have that same clause, where we can relocate them.
It's not in this agreement.
It is in the agreements over in building #1.
I'm saying, if in a year from now, if they want to go over there,
to that building, there's appropriate space over there for them. Oh, absolutely.
We have comparable space elsewhere.
I guess, to answer your question, Mr. Carter, if somebody knocked on our doors,
[and said] "You know what? We love that space, we want a 5 year agreement." We'd talk to the Chamber,
and work something out. That would not be very... [difficult].
Well, I'm just wondering what's
happening with it. Every time I look, and then I read the articles
in the paper, and one is saying this and that.
It has, I understand, 700,000 stops here, or something like that? Am I wrong on that number?
No, they have had a tremendous amount
of foot traffic here. So much so, they've actually even kept
the building open on Saturdays in the summer.
And, we're getting this new sign in here, and all of that stuff's going to be
on the new sign. One of those things on that sign says, "tourist information next right".
When you're coming southbound. That's definitely going to...(interrupts): With the Ogdensburg Chamber,
and all that. (continues): Increase traffic, yes.
Apparently they're
some people that would like to see it back downtown again.
I don't know the reasons. The traffic has increased here
at sevenfold, or something like that. This is the smartest they ever made.
To move here. You know, way back, when we offered
this...Don, you were here. We offered this to Jennifer.
The same thing. They were out the door at BOCES.
And, we jumped in then to help them. We jumped in ahead of time.
That young lady over there served on the thing.
I just want to kind of nicely let them know,
that we're going to put this thing on the market. We're not going to sit back
and wait for them to leave.
I'm not going to kid around with them. Because if somebody comes,
and somebody says to John, "Listen, I could use this,
I'm a new doctor coming in the area". And, John goes, "I'd like that, but,
if the Chamber wasn't there, then we've got a deal for him." I want John to know that
he's got some flexibility to rent that space.
I'll do whatever I can for the Chamber, but I'm not going to be used, is what I'm saying.
One of the things...I voiced this to the
City Manager was, first of all,
the Chamber office has been downtown 3 different times. Yes. It was in the Community Center
twice, back when I was the Parks and Rec Director, Fitz, and then Dobinsky,
and then it was in City Hall. And then they moved down to the
BOCES building. Yeah. Right. Downtown hasn't worked for them.
No. They don't get...at the present time...(interrupts): And, BOCES didn't work for them.
BOCES didn't work for them, because they were in there on that.
But here, we opened the door to them forever and ever,
and we keep getting "whacked" because....
(interrupts): I don't believe that, Fred. What? I don't believe that we get whacked. I don't think so.
Well, somebody's playing with something they don't need to play with, Sam.
I talked to those people in regards to...(interrupts): It ain't the people.
(continues): Well, it's not the people, but...honestly, I look at...
I'm grateful for them, that they want to be here.
I'm grateful that they're part of that growth plate (?)
that we want people to know about Ogdensburg, and do those type of things here.
So, I'm happy they're here. So am I. With open arms,
I would believe them. Obviously, I'm not sure what threats are going to be next for the city,
where they want to go, but that's okay. But, for the time being,
I'm happy they're here. But you just heard the Executive Director say they wanted a shorter agreement.
Well, I don't know about that part, but maybe that was before the other.
I'm not saying you're wrong, Fred,
I'm just saying, I look at the opposite side,
where we're happy to have them. We've got space. We've got space over there. And, a lot of things
can happen with that space, being creative. Space over where?
The Breckenridge Building. There's all sorts of office space,
and stuff in there. They've already opened up space over there, for offices and stuff,
people go in there. We might be over there.
Definitely a traffic-getter for the building. Absolutely.
Without a doubt. Moving right along...I'll move it.
Oh, we're moving it? Yeah. Well, yeah. Where do you want to go with it?
(laughter) I just asked the question. Okay, well...
We have a motion with Mr. Loffler. I second it.
We have a second. Any further questions or comments? Not anymore.
Okay. All right. All those in favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
All ayes, thank you.
Okay, the next agenda item, A3, is definitely predicated on ice.
(laughter) There's an ice fishing tournament that's scheduled for
February 16, 2013. I make a motion to approve it.
Any further questions, comments? No?
All in favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
I've got all the ayes. I made the motion. You didn't make an aye.
(chuckles) Aye. A lot of people make motions that never "ayed" it.
(chuckles) That brings us over to A4.
Approval of Agency Liaison to the Office of the Prevention of
Domestic Violence. This is something that,
according to the Executive Order 19, we need to do. It was a referral from
the Governance Committee, to the full board for action.
Do we want to move that? You can see in this
particular thing we added the Deputy Executive Director too,
will also get the necessary training.
So we have a backup on that, and that's where we added that from the Governance Committee.
I'll second. Okay, we have a second. Don motioned it.
Ramona second. That's a good point, Fred, for saying that.
Any further comments or questions?
All those in favor signify by saying aye? Aye. There are the ayes.
Agenda A5 is the approval of the Management/Confidential
Salary Schedule. It's recommended,
it went to the Personnel Committee, then it was recommended to the full board.
That salary increase consistent with CPI, 1/87%.
Extended to Management/Confidential employees for 2013.
The policy is on page 23,
page 24 is the calculation, and page 25 is the
source data. Is the first time for a raise in a while?
There were no raises last year.
I make a motion to improve this increase.
Second. Second by Mr. Loffler.
Any further comments, questions? All in favor signify by saying aye?
Aye. Agenda item A7.
It's approval of a Workplace Prevention policy
and Response Plan. This is under the same Executive Order, Executive Order 19.
It requires us to put this into effect,
Governance Committee met on December 5th, to read the policy,
and forwarded it for board action. It's just another little...(unintelligible)
Now, this is just a quick...
notation on this one. This is the equivalent of a first reading.
Generally, when something comes from the Governance Committee, we look at it,
we let it sit, and then we pick it up next time.
Motion's made, I'll second it. Second. There was no first motion.
No motion? No, Don did. Don did? Yes.
Wade, you should change this to update it to whom they can contact,
now that you've got 2 people. We actually specified
the contacts. And, we specified
the position of the contact in there, but not the person. So, that way if the person ever changes,
we don't need to go back there, and update policies. Thank you, for that suggestion, though.
No further comments, questions?
All those in favor, signify by saying aye?
I just hope we can live up to all the requirements. It's a lot of work. Oh, definitely, I hear you.
It's a lot of work. No doubt about those 2 guys. (chuckles)
But I think they'll do a wonderful job on it. Off to my work.
Oh, I do. (chuckles) We've got the policy. Then, the training was over
in November, before they even got the policy. (laughter) Before we got the notification.
(laughter - cross talk - unintelligible)
Speaking of which, you will...
see some of these things again, at the January meeting, because they need
to fall into our normal cycle of annual
stuff to be appointed. Next up is agenda item B1, over on
page 35. This is storage agreements with Frank Richardson,
Mr. Bird Tate, and Terry Davies,
for T hangars at the airport.
Period for Mr. Richardson, January 1, through December 31, 2013.
Bird Tate, and Terry Davies,
are new folks to us. And, the term of their lease is
December 1, through November 30, 2013.
How come we're doing this combined, Fred?
Usually all of the leases are separate. We do, sometimes when they're
very similar, we do this type of format.
So, that way we don't need to have 3 separate agenda items,
and 3 separate maps behind them. It just helps keep the thickness of the packet down.
Nice space we have there. I've never seen that. You can see
who's where, on page 36.
I need a motion. I'll make that. Ramona.
Second. Mr. Chairman, I'm going to have to abstain
on this. One of these people
is a former (unintelligible) with my firm, I think I have to step aside.
Okay. I'll make a note of it.
Okay, any further comments? All those in favor, signify by saying aye?
Okay, agenda item C1. This is approval of a lease supplement...
(chuckles) (interrupts): Did you think I kicked you to say aye?
(continues): With risk and asset management. This is for
744 square feet in the 12th industrial building. The term is
December 15th of this year, through December 14th of next year, at the rates, terms,
and conditions you see before you. And there's a map
on page 38. I move.
Second, Don. Further comments, questions?
Okay, all those in favor, signify by saying aye?
Aye. (laughter)
(laughter - crosstalk - unintelligible) We've been here a long time
(laughter - cross talk - unintelligible) No, we've never heard that.
(laughter) We've been talking...I've haven't turned to you all day.
Oh, golly. Okay.
They even got a map there. Agenda item D1. This is the storage and handling
agreement with Poulin Grain. This January 1, 2013,
through December 31, 2013. And, this is
for citrus pulp, at the Port of Ogdensburg, at the rates you see before you.
I make a motion to approve. I'll second.
Second. Any questions or comments? All in favor,
signify by saying aye? Aye.
Now, just a couple seconds. Steve,
this is being offloaded out of the box cars with the...
No, with the conveyor.
Are you talking about Poulin Grain coming in by rail?
There's a (unintelligible)...stuff down at the cottonseed? Yeah, that's a separate...
the railroad has that. Oh, that's the railroad doing that? Yeah,
the railroad has a deal with Bertrand, and they bring in that cottonseed,
and Bertrand does all their loading, and unloading.
Who is that Bertrand guy? They're a trucking outfit that handles the
distribution of that cottonseed. They purchase the cottonseed,
and they offload that to local farmers
as a feed supplement. So, they load their own trucks? Yes.
That's their own loader, then. Yeah, they keep it right in that box there, and they...
as they can, like 3, or 4 cars at a time,
they'll offload them, and through the North Country, they drop it off
to different farmers. Oh, okay. Steve, one thing that just came to mind,
as I was hearing that, we need to throw on our list
of things to do. They are an agent of the railroad, but they still do
need to provide us with proof of insurance. And, that's something that I think we need to take care of.
Because, they are running equipment down there.
So, if you'd just throw that on the to-do list, if you would, please.
Or, actually, it would probably be more appropriate in your group, Fred.
Yeah, the railroad should be able to provide that.
(laughter) Under other such matters, there are a couple of other such matters.
It's in your separate packet, labeled E1.
Did we vote on that? The motion was made and seconded, but did we vote on it?
Yes. Yes, we did.
Your voice was weak that time. (laughter)
So, agenda item E1, is approval of a use permit for St. Lawrence Federal Credit Union.
As you know, the credit union's expanding,
they need a place to park while they're expanding. They would like to use our
parking lot out front of the
building #1, in the industrial park.
And, we've procured this as a use permit. Because, it's not
really anything that...
it's not really anything that we necessarily want to charge them for.
I'm looking for it. It's the next one. It's strictly, all they've got to use
it for is parking. For mostly employee parking.
So they've got more access
to the members of the park there now. Mr. Chairman, I'll have to abstain
from voting on that issue, because I'm a member of that credit union.
You're a member? Yes, I am a member of that credit union.
I can't be...(interrupts): Well, I don't think if you're a member of the directors, on the board. He's on the board. Well, that's what I'm saying.
I'm a member. Well, there we go. You were one of my clients. There we go.
(laughter) Don, do you do their books?
(laughter - cross talk - unintelligible) Years ago I did their payroll for them.
I think that definitely disqualifies you. I don't think it's a disqualifying
event. No, I don't think so either. Well, all I thought was I'd tell you.
(laughter) I make a motion to approve it. Second.
Second from Don. Boy, you're really going to have a lot of stuff on that screen when you get done.
(laughter) I can say one thing, when it's done, it's going to be very nice.
Is it? Yes. Once you get the slides out, it's going to be very nice. That's good.
Further questions, comments? All those in favor, signify by saying aye?
Aye. Agenda item E3.
It's approval of a handling and storage agreement with
Bunge ETGO. And, what this if for, this is for canola meal at the port.
Start date is potentially the 15th,
of this month, and would end February 28th of 2013,
at the rates, terms, and conditions you see before you.
This would come in by rail.
And, there's not much more to say about that, other than it's a contract for up to
10,000 short tons. Wade, we approved a little earlier
of a silo.
In this process with a silo system, versus flat storage, or rolling storage,
would this work...
which ones work, and which don't work? Potentially, if you have this sitting
right next to a rail somewhere, you would be able to unload directly into the silo,
and it would eliminate the operation you see over there on the wall. So, the silo operation
it's going to be near the rail, is that the idea, Steve? Yes. Okay,
so this would really be labor saving? The throughput, you could
me moving out almost as much as coming in. So, you're just using it as temporary storage
rather than trying to fit all 10,000 in one area and truck it out.
So, it will always be diminishing inventory.
So, the question you were saying, yeah, I think that would for this.
It depends on how quickly they bring that stuff in.
What I guess my point is, we talked about it before, the strategy is to
change our system to a silo system, so they're all going to be
in a position to utilize them,
so they're not moving stuff all over the place, I guess that's what I'm saying.
Yeah, minimize the handling. Okay. So, that will be, basically stuff off the rail?
Is that what you're saying, Wade? That's how the majority of our end products
come in, so that's where we would focus first. Yeah. Okay.
Excellent thoughts. I need a motion?
Don? So motioned. Okay, Don. I'll second.
Got Ramona seconds. Any further questions comments?
All in favor signify by saying aye? Aye.
Nice to see business, let's continue that.
Agenda item E4, is approval of agreement with the department
of the Army. What this is, this is...
culmination of efforts that we've been in discussion
with the Army Corps of Engineers. Significant help from
Senator Joe Griffo office, and also Congressman Owen's office,
on this issue, to deepen the port,
at the western end of the...
what the call the lower east entrance channel,
to Ogdensburg Harbor. And what this is, this is a
cautionary agreement, that says everything...
the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers will fund this study
up to $100,000. And, everything over that,
is shared equally. And, to give you an idea,
of what you get...(interrupts): Where'd you find that book?
Oh, I dug this one out. 1985, or something like that. It's a 1982.
Section 107 study. This thing today,
is going to cost between 200 and $500,000.
Overall. And, what this will do,
the likely outcome of the new one, is the recommendation to
deepen the port of Ogdensburg. Dredging is what we used to call it. The Corps calls it deepening.
So, do you utilize that document, too?
That document is really too old to be of any use. Oh, really?
But, what they'll do, is they'll go through and basically create a new one.
It's done on a current business condition...(interrupts): (unintelligible) Demarco would do, though.
You know? Tomorrow. He'd be happy to have that book.
(chuckles) All they do is change the cover, Sam. (laughter)
(unintelligible - laughter) See, that's the stuff that I was telling you about.
With them. That stuff now is on the internet.
Yeah. All that kind of stuff is there.
Just by pushing a button. Oh, it's amazing.
I'm telling you, you wait 'til you see this system, I'm telling you.
They'll leave it in the boardroom, they can put it right up on the wall, on the screens.
Okay. You think it's heavy, I'm telling you, it'll save a lot of work.
With that ticket company, you could just go right around with it. Mr. Chairman, I make a motion
that we adopt this resolution E4.
Do we have a second? From Doug.
Any comments, questions? Just one observation,
Frank, this is similar the FAA type of agreements,
and there is a certification of counsel needed on this agreement, as well.
Do you have any projection on what this
would cost the bridge and port authority? (unintelligible)
The project itself, is going to cost somewhere between 200 and $500,000.
Of that money, 100,000 of it's going to be picked up
by Army Corps, right off the bat. That's going to be shared equally?
And then, cost share of 50/50. Now, on top of that, there's some things that we
can provide, like in-tying services. Things of that nature. So, it's not
just all cash. What kind of in-tying services?
Copying, and things like that? Staff time, I know my time can
count on that, Steve's time. We've got to do some things
which, I need to talk to you about, by the way, I got a new list today. Things that they need
like some information on the
wall for example. The copy of our previous engineering
report. Some different stuff like that, so we can charge all the staff time associated
with tracking this stuff down. So, I'm thinking, right off the top...
top end, 500,000, they take the first 100, we split the next 400.
But, some of that can be made by in-tying services. Yes.
Yeah, that kind of stands that we're...(interrupts): Is it quantified, how much you can do in-tying?
It's not. But, this is something we all know,
that has to be done. We could probably get away with (unintelligible)
It speaks (unintelligible) about that, in the stock and card.
I read it, Fred, it's complicated the way they come up with the money. Yeah.
I can see that it's very interesting. We're going to have hire
an accountant to look this over. (chuckles)
We'll have to get Doug a lawyer, too. (laughter) Well, now we are in trouble!
(laughter) Well, the good part about this is...
(interrupts): Nobody knows this. (continues): We've got to (cross talk - laughter - unintelligible)
...We'll get some ships in, so we've got to go. It's not an option.
Yeah. You know what Steve's doing. I wasn't here for that. (chuckles)
Wade, did you tell Fred you got your new scuba diving equipment,
so you can check it out? Well, Steve's got Wade all ready to go. (laughter)
You're allowed to (unintelligible) down there. (chuckles) Somebody's got to check it. Anything else, Wade?
No, Mr. Chairman. Did we vote on that? We didn't vote on that. No, not yet.
Motion was made by me, seconded by Don. Okay, yes, that's true.
All those in favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
Is that it?
We need a Border Station Meeting as well. There is a need for a Border Station Meeting.
Okay, last comment? There is a need? Yes, there is. There is a need for a Border Station? Okay, let's close
this one. I need a motion to adjourn.
I'll move it. Doug. Second. Don.
Any further questions, comments on that? All in favor signify by saying aye?
What about...we've got a resolution that's in here, I'd just seen it.
On the Executive Director? Oh, we're going to table it.
No, but I didn't want to go on record tabling it. Oh, okay.
It's part of the document, part of the thing that's been given to the press.
Okay. Then, let's back up to
agenda item B2. Approval of the
extension of contract with the Executive Director.
Has been postponed, because of ongoing negotiations on
the agreement. I make a motion
to table it. Okay. We have a motion to table. Second. Second.
In favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
Aye. (laughter - cross talk - unintelligible)
Well, if somebody did ask question, yeah, good point. Yeah. "What happened then?"
Well, you know the...
Do you want to start the Border Station? I agree.
I make a motion to adjourn the regular meeting.
Second. Second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye? Aye.
Verified that, okay. (cross talk - unintelligible)
I better watch myself, he might not give me a ride home. (chuckles)
Oh, you'll be back. (laughter)
(laughter) Good night for a walk. (laughter)